Posted on: February 17, 2021

Have you ever wondered if Direct Mail still works in 2021 despite the emerging strategies to do marketing online? Well, get ready as our guest talks about how he hit deals in wholesaling through it and making it stand out from the rest.

We have invited Ryan Dossey to share his expertise on making Direct Mail works, particularly in 2021, as one of the marketing channels. He is a Founder at Call Porter, an online service that qualifies, screens, and schedules appointments with your inbound seller leads. He is a buy and hold investor featured in various industry podcasts.

In today’s episode, he will talk about doing Direct Mail the right way and the importance of putting a brand on it. He will also share strategies on taking every call so as not to miss any deals. Aside from that, he will share tips on the lists that he considers valuable. Listeners will discover what he does to stay on top in terms of using Direct Mail.

Learn a lot from the expert and get valuable tips in doing wholesaling through his marketing strategy! Listen to this episode!

Key Takeaways

  • How Ryan started with wholesaling and scaling it
  • How to put your brand on Direct Mail and why
  • Why people get bad reviews in using Direct Mail
  • On putting the “Flick me a text” add on and metrics he uses to track its effectiveness
  • Taking calls through the acquisitions manager
  • Other options in taking those calls
  • On segmenting duplicates and merging property owners to make Direct Mail effective in 2021
  • His view on the list to consider in 2021
  • The importance of using the expired list in making deals
  • On adding value by putting the brand in Direct Mail
  • Ryan talks about what Call Porter offers
  • On sending something different to clients as his edge

RESOURCES:

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Episode Transcription

Chris Arnold:
Welcome to the Wholesaling Inc podcast. I’m your host, Chris Arnold. As always, thanks for hanging out with us today. Man, I like to bring you guys some practical stuff. I like the type of podcast like when I get off of it there’s two or three things that I wrote down and I’m like, “I can’t wait to get into the office tomorrow because I know these are actionable items.”
That’s what you’re going to get today, and you’re going to get it around direct mail. Like, “Chris, direct mail. You’re always talking radio.” Well, I got my boy, good buddy of mine and literally one of the smartest marketing guys I know. He’s a multiplier of his brother. One of the main reasons we brought him in other than the fact that I just loved this guy to death and that is Ryan Dossey.
Dude, he knows direct mail backwards and forwards and I was like, “Ryan, let’s do a podcast for 2021, and kind of the topic being like how do you make direct mail work in 2021?” And Ryan is like, “I’m all over this. Let’s do it. Let’s add some dye to the tribe.” So Ryan, what’s up buddy? Welcome to the show, man.

Ryan Dossey:
What’s up, man? Thank you for having me. I’m pumped.

Chris Arnold:
Well, dude, for those that don’t know Ryan Dossey, I know a lot of people do, give us a quick snapshot. Where are you at? How long have you been in the game? What are your credentials, man?

Ryan Dossey:
Good question. I think I started back in 2014 or ’15. Like most people, it’s kind of like the old side hustle deal. I was making 22 grand a year, pre-tax at my W2. So I got to a point that I was just like, “Okay, screw this.”
My first deal, I made like 10 grand. I had a partner on that one and realized I just made six months of my life in three hours. What am I doing? And I’ve been kind of hooked ever since. So I went full time in 2016. It was a super rough year. I think I did six deals. 2017, I did 74 deals and kept four rentals.

Chris Arnold:
Come on now, that’s what you call a quick scale right there.

Ryan Dossey:
Yeah. I was bored with those little checks. And then between ’18 and ’19 we closed on right at like 150 units. 130 of those were in Indianapolis. Another 10 in St. Louis. Another 10 in Louisville, Kentucky. Then we buy and sell probably five to 10 properties a month right now as well.

Chris Arnold:
And the reason I love Ryan is, I mean, you hear those numbers, Ryan is an outlier. He’s somebody that you look at and go, “That’s not the normal trajectory.” So when I find an outlier like that, again, Tim Ferriss talks a lot about this, when you go to achieve something, don’t find what everyone’s doing. Find the anomaly. One thing I love about Ryan he’s just an absolute anomaly. And you’ll find it’s because the way he thinks, man. This guy just geeks out on marketing, which I love.

Ryan Dossey:
I’m a nerd.

Chris Arnold:
[inaudible 00:03:31] You’re a cool nerd, for sure.

Ryan Dossey:
I appreciate that.

Chris Arnold:
You are, man. Again, if you want to see us as always, put a face with the name, go to YouTube, subscribe with Chris on real estate and you can actually watch as well today. So let’s hop in, man. Let’s get to the meat of this. I want some actionable items, some stuff that I could apply to my direct mail. And yes, if you’re listening, we do direct mail still, even though I’m a huge radio fan.
Direct mail is one of the five marketing channels that we have kept. So let’s talk about this. Let’s come out of the gate behind on this one. Number one is putting your brand on your direct mail. Ooh, that’s not talked about a lot, right? Actually, putting your brand on now. Let’s talk about this nugget and why.

Ryan Dossey:
Yeah. So I actually get a kick out of there’s a lot of guys that are kind of loud that like to like, “Oh, you should never do branded direct mail. People want to work with like small individual businesses and stuff.” I think that was the case until like Amazon and Yelp came along. People are checking reviews on toilet paper. You don’t think they want to know if the guy who’s going to buy their house is legit or not. We literally have sellers tell us all the time, “Hey, I was talking to company X in town, but your reviews were better, so I’m going to take your offer.”
So it’s kind of one of those like when you build a brand there’s responsibility. If you do it right, it’s your biggest asset. If you do it wrong, you’re screwed. If you’re not taking care of people, you’re not doing what you’re saying you’re going to do, those reviews stack up real quick.

Chris Arnold:
Yeah, absolutely. So you think it’s important to pick up those reviews? Now, what about some that might argue the other side and go, “Hey, there’s people that receive these pieces of direct mail and they’re not happy to receive them in the mailbox. Now, I’m attaching my company name to that.” How do you feel about that?

Ryan Dossey:
So I’ve sent in Indianapolis, I would say probably three quarters of a million to a million pieces of mail in the five or six years I’ve been there. I’ve had one bad review over somebody that didn’t like getting a letter. So where people normally-

Chris Arnold:
Half those people will call in and tell you how much they despise your direct mail, they actually won’t go in and do anything online. There’s that big of a gap.

Ryan Dossey:
So here’s why people give bad reviews. I did a video on this, but you’ve got to actually take people off the list when they tell you to take them off the list. So when somebody calls in and says, “Hey, remove me,” I use REI Simple as my CRM. Every new mail campaign, I export out anybody who’s interacted with my company and scrub all of those property addresses from my list. So I’m not re-mailing people who call me and say, “Hey, go to hell for sending me this.” I’m not going to send that guy five more pieces like my competitors are.
A lot of investors are like, “Oh, you can’t really take people off the list.” I mean, you’re wasting a ton of money if you’re not taking people off the list. But people only take the time to go leave a bad review. If they’re real fired up, they get a piece of mail and they’re upset about it. Okay. They get five from you, oh, they’re angry.

Chris Arnold:
So you’re managing really the frustration level by actually listening to people. And it sounds like from the overall list, you’re doing a good job of pulling people off that don’t want to be on there and continuing to work that list where I think most people are probably too lazy to do that, to be honest with you.

Ryan Dossey:
Dude, it takes like-

Chris Arnold:
I mean, they’re like, “My company name is not on there. So what do I care?” So in the event that you are utilizing it for branding, make sure that you’re listening to the people that are responding back.

Ryan Dossey:
Well, and I think people don’t even realize, even if you don’t market branded, there’s websites where people can leave reviews about phone numbers. So like Google your phone number, see what comes up. There might be a bunch of people that are like, “Yeah, these guys won’t stop sending me letters.” You might think people aren’t going to Google you when they get a letter. Trust me, they are. They’re Googling your phone number, the name. They’re trying to figure out who this is.
Especially if you’re using the stuff, that’s like a little shady, right? The like final expiring notice type stuff. They’re like, “All right, who’s this A-hole?” So people are going to look.

Chris Arnold:
All right. Hey, man. It’s contrary to mine. So if you guys are listening to Ryan, again, Ryan is an outlier, right? He’s usually going to come into the back door from what most people do. So definitely something to consider. Now, let’s go to number two here. I think this is potentially a no-brainer. I love it. So we’re talking about the direct mail card itself. Now you, what you’re doing on here is what you’re calling, flick me a text. So let’s talk about this. This is an interesting piece to add on your direct mail postcard.

Ryan Dossey:
Yeah. So this actually came from one of my clients. I would love to pretend that I’m the only one who has good ideas, but one of my clients is like-

Chris Arnold:
It don’t matter. You don’t have to be the originator, man. You have great ideas.

Ryan Dossey:
He was like, “Bro, this works.” So one of the things we’ve started adding in, if you’re using inbound numbers like ours go through REI Simple, I don’t know who you recommend, Chris.

Chris Arnold:
We love REI Simple. So as you say that, anyone listening knows that we really value that as a CRM.

Ryan Dossey:
So as people text or call in those leads come in either way. So what you’ll find is different people respond to different things. So like for instance, I mentioned putting my website on my mail, over 33% of my leads, get a piece of direct mail, go to my website and check me out and then fill out a form or call the tracking number that’s on my website. They’re not just calling straight off that letter.
So you’re going to have people that picking up the phone is intimidating, but they’ll flick a text or they’ll to the website and fill out a form. So you just give people other options. And if you don’t say, “Hey, you can flick me a text,” they’re not going to think to do that. So that’s another good way to potentially pull some of those weights.

Chris Arnold:
I agree. I got to be honest with you, it probably wouldn’t cross my mind if I received postcard to text that person.

Ryan Dossey:
Never.

Chris Arnold:
I’d probably assume I couldn’t.

Ryan Dossey:
No, I wouldn’t text Geico, right? I get a letter like, “What’s this cost?” No.

Chris Arnold:
What’s some data that you’ve seen around this that you could kind of share on the value of adding that? I’m sure you’re getting more inbound opportunities, but what type of metrics have you been able to track with this?

Ryan Dossey:
So this is pretty new for us, but what we’ve seen is about a 20% increase in the existing response. So if you’re getting a 1%, you’re at a 1.2. If you’re getting a one and a half, you’re at a 1.8.

Chris Arnold:
20%. Bumped is not bad for simply adding a line at under the phone number that says [inaudible 00:09:49]. That’s a no brainer.

Ryan Dossey:
Yeah. Not at all. I’m not going to lie. It feels real good. When you buy a house strictly through texts that you’ve never talked to the person on the phone. We bought two duplexes from a guy that texted in and was like, “Okay, here’s the address. Just give me your offer.” I was like, “Boom, this.” He was like, “All right. Here’s how you can get keys from my property manager.” Contract signed, signed closed. Never even talked to the dude. I was like, “That was glorious.”

Chris Arnold:
Mean, if every deal could be done like that-

Ryan Dossey:
Oh dude, it’d be great.

Chris Arnold:
Well, man, let’s go to another point. That’s a great one right there. So if you’re listening, you told me that and I was like, I can go back and tell my team. That didn’t even cross my mind. Excellent nuggets. So, okay. I think most people are listening, Ryan. They are going to send these calls to voicemail, because, again, over half of these calls are hate calls, or “I’m listening. I’m working a nine to five,” or whatever that looks like. I just don’t have time to manage the backside of this. But you want to challenge that on going live answer on it. So talk to us through this. Convince us, what data do you have?

Ryan Dossey:
I mean, it’s really pretty easy. Yu can’t have a company that has a bad customer experience and expect for it to go well. That’s something I actually got from Facebook. Facebook is huge. And one of their big focuses is the customer experience. So when it comes to like the direct mail piece or Facebook ads or Google Ads, whatever it is you’re doing to generate traffic, when you say, “Give me a call,” and then don’t pick up the phone, they feel like slighted. You asked me to call you, Chris. I called you. And then you didn’t pick up. I don’t know if you’ve ever done that with a buddy like, “Hey, they text you. Call me.” You call them and they don’t answer. You’re like, “What an idiot.” Right? You just asked me to call you.
Sellers are the same way. I think what’s different that we’ve seen in my personal business, you can like be downright abusive as far as a business goes, like make people listen to your seven-minute recording before they get to the press two to get over to like, whatever. You can have them go through all this stuff. The deals that I get are typically nicer properties than what most people are getting because I’m getting affluent people that want to trade equity for an easy transaction.
Those kinds of people aren’t going to jump through the hoops. “Hey, you called me. Or send me a letter, Chris. What’s your offer? “You don’t pick up, we pick up, “Hey, here’s the process. Let me come on out.” We hear from sellers all the time like, “Yeah, I called three or four people in town.” You guys are the only ones that even answered the phone.

Chris Arnold:
You feel like the juice is worth the squeeze on that dealing with the headache of the people that are haters calling in because of the upside on the deals that you’re going to get if you do answer these calls live?

Ryan Dossey:
So let me be blunt. I don’t take my own phone calls. My own call porter for anybody who doesn’t know, we take inbound calls for investors. But a lot of guys, we’ve got some guys in multipliers that our clients. They’ll like, “I’m going to have my acquisitions manager take my calls.” A closer’s best use of time isn’t being told where to go stick it 33% of the time.

Chris Arnold:
I agree. That’s why we never sent those calls directly to our acquisition managers. We always add a pre-screener or pre-qualifier.

Ryan Dossey:
Well, and I would say mindset is huge. So if you’re like a solopreneur, having one out of three people tell you to go to hell is going to grate you down no matter how tough you pretend to be. You’re going to start to like pre-judge and, “Oh, this guy sounds like that guy.” So whether it’s my company, somebody else’s company, you’re an employee you hire, you’ve got to take them live. And ideally you don’t want your person who’s making the offers, even being involved in that process because otherwise they’re going to prejudge stuff and miss deals.

Chris Arnold:
I totally agree. Okay. So what are my options here? I’m listening and going, “Okay, Ryan, you got me. I need to take these calls live, but you’ve also convinced me I don’t want to do it myself.” And maybe they even convinced me like the first thing I thought is, “No way I’m taking those calls.”

Ryan Dossey:
It was horrible. I worked in call centers for years.

Chris Arnold:
What are the options that somebody has for this process so that they don’t have to do that themselves?

Ryan Dossey:
I mean, there’s tons of answering services that are out there. Call Porter is ours. There’s like Call Ruby, PATLive. The other option is hiring your own staff to do it. That was how I actually started our answering service. I hired one girl to take my calls, but then I couldn’t justify the cost of paying somebody $3,000 a month to take my 40 calls that I had at the time. So I hired a couple more people, took calls for buddies and then it kind of grew from there.
So you can go that route. I’ve got a friend of mine that has a VA that takes those calls. I don’t super love the VA route because I don’t know about your market, dude. People in my market are racist that’s all, “Get out.” If they even like get a hint that somebody is not American or not local, they’ll like rip their throat open. So if you’re going to hire somebody else to do it, hire an ex-pat. If you’re going to go the VA route, hire somebody that sounds like they’re in the US or is even in the US would be my recommendation.

Chris Arnold:
Man, I agree with you on the fact of going live. So our solution to that is we have in-house people that fundamentally what you would do for something like a Call Porter. But if you’re listening, I would tell you like hire someone in-house. If you don’t, then I think a great alternative to that, if you’re like, “Dude, I don’t want to hire someone, train them, manage them,” then kick it over to Ryan’s company like Call Porter and go that route. Again, numerous companies that do this. So it is definitely an option.

Ryan Dossey:
I mean, it doesn’t make sense financially for most people when they’re starting out to have an employee that’s… I mean, to have somebody good, you’re 12, 15 bucks an hour. You don’t really want to throw $2,000 a month at that if your marketing budgets 3,000. I’d rather you do more direct to seller stuff and then less on the backend.

Chris Arnold:
Absolutely, man. So process that out. But Ryan’s providing a good, I think solution there. But totally agree on… And it’s funny. I was telling you before the call, I had Don Costa on here. Obviously, Don’s the man, the myth, the legend, and he brought up the same point. Instead on all his direct mail, he’s answering these things live. And he said, “Man, I think people have just seen this backwards for a long time by shooting it all to voicemail.”
So you’re the second person that’s come on, I’d say in the last two months on this podcast that’s gave that same point, which I think is great. So cool. Let’s go into a practical thing here on list building. I want to talk a little bit about duplicates. You’ve got an interesting perspective here. And again, if you list the thing I like about Ryan is like he can get really granular on stuff. This is why he’s really [crosstalk 00:16:18].

Ryan Dossey:
But I’m trying to keep it practical.

Chris Arnold:
I know, but you were like tearing down to the studs, which I love. And then he’ll be like, “Hey, here’s like a small, practical, granular thing that you can do.” And we’re going to get one of those that can make a really big difference on whether or not you get a deal. So let’s talk about duplicates. What most people do and what they should do for 2021, if they want their direct mail to be effective.

Ryan Dossey:
Yeah. Honestly, it’s direct mail. It’s cold calling. It’s texting. It’s any form of prospecting you’re doing. Most people are buying a list from ListSource or a prop stream or something. On ListSource there’s a button that says remove duplicates, which if somebody owns 10 properties, it’s picking one. How do we know that’s the one they want to sell? So what we do that makes us stand out from everybody else in our market, if I’ve got somebody who owns, say, three properties, instead of me just picking one or marketing to them separately on all three, we’re going to have a VA go through or use a software to go through and merge those down.
So instead of me having one guy with 10 properties, so he’s in my list 10 times, I’ve got one guy with one long column of all the properties he owns. You’ve got somebody who, say, owns three properties and you send them a, “Hey, I’m interested in your properties on Poplar Main and Elm Street. Give me a call if you’re interested in selling for cash. You now look smarter, savvier and you know what’s going on more than any other person who’s ever sent that guy a letter, because everybody else is picking a random one or mailing this one guy on all three.

Chris Arnold:
Yeah. Dude, when you something like that, it’s just one of those small practicalities that gets overlooked and you hear it and you go, “That makes sense. If I got a lot of direct mail on everybody, it’s like calling me by the wrong name.” In direct mail, everyone is calling me Mike, and my name is John. And then finally one letter comes through and it says stuff like, “These guys don’t know who they’re talking to.” [crosstalk 00:18:10].

Ryan Dossey:
I’ve got two other practicals that I didn’t actually even tell you before we hopped on. Call out the asset type. So if you’re marketing two condos, “I want to buy your condo at address instead of just property.”

Chris Arnold:
I love that.

Ryan Dossey:
Same thing with duplex, triplex, quad. And then when we get into apartments, we’ll call it your apartment or your buildings, if it’s a larger facility. So again, most people are marketing to duplexes with a, “Hey, I want to buy your property or triplexes.” I know back when I started, I would do one through four units and send them all the same copy. We’ll now segment it into, “I want to buy your condo, Chris, or your duplex or triplex.” So you knew that.
Then the third and final one is make sure you merge multiple property owners. So if Chris and Charlene own a property together and I just mailed Charlene and Chris, get the mail, Chris is bitter of like, “I own this property too.” So we’ll take the time to go through and merge Chris and Charlene that way the letter comes addressed to both people. That way if either of them open it, they feel like it’s to them and not like they opened the other person’s mail.

Chris Arnold:
I love it, man. And I want to step back here because for those that are listening, I want to address something and I think it’s a really important principle on something that Ryan is modeling for all of us right now. And as I see people come in, Ryan just start a marketing channel and they get basically good at it, and then they go launch the second and the third and fourth. And before you know it, they’re half-assing a bunch of different marketing channels and honestly complaining about how they don’t work.
I just want you to listen to the detail of how far Ryan is taking his understanding of direct mail and understand that this is how a marketing person thinks. They literally will go down every rabbit trail, every potential option, split testing, all those types of things,. And you can just hear Ryan’s expertise around this. I feel like for a lot of us listening, and this is even a good reminder for myself, this is what it sounds like to really get granular on something and become really great at it.
But that’s why you’re doing so well with direct mail because you put this time and attention on it, which I love. So mad props to you, but I think there’s some modeling that you’re doing for us that’s just great. So let’s go this last piece, right? I want to talk about a couple of lists that those listening should consider for 2021 might’ve overlooked, but, hey, I’m pulling some lists, Ryan. You know what you’re talking about. Tell me a couple lists here. Get me on the cutting edge of maybe why I should consider for 2021. What would those be?

Ryan Dossey:
Yeah. So one that I’m doing that I mail every single month is individuals that are absentee. So no trust, no companies. And then PropStream actually lets you filter by the number of properties they own. So I’ll do absentee owned properties, owned by individuals who own less than three properties in Indianapolis, which is a million plus people. That’s only like 13,000 people.
So that’s a pretty good subset of people that like these aren’t super skilled landlords. A lot of these are mom-and-pop type folks. So that’s one list that I’m absolutely loving. Second one that I didn’t tell you about either, and this is my absolute favorite mailing list is like the vinyl village properties. So if anybody follows me on social, you’ll notice I often share these really nice properties we’re buying. And that’s because that’s what I’m targeting.
So I’ll do properties bill 1989 or newer. 1,000 square feet or more. Three bedrooms or more. One and a half baths or more with a 35 to 100% equity range. And that gets us kind of that nice, every flipper, every landlord, every tenant wants that asset. Or then it’s like shooting fish in a barrel when it comes to monetizing that opportunity.

Chris Arnold:
Okay. Now you had mentioned a third. I know I said two and you slipped one in there. Do you just want to hit on that expired MLS list?

Ryan Dossey:
Refresh my memory. What was the third one?

Chris Arnold:
It was expired MLS.

Ryan Dossey:
Oh, yeah. I’m kind of a smart-ass.

Chris Arnold:
Right. I got more nuggets here. I can’t even keep up with it.

Ryan Dossey:
Yeah. We still have one big one you missed that I’m going to bring back up. But I’m kind of a smart when it comes to just life in general. So my favorite thing with expired listings to PropStream list, expired MLS listings with equity and you can add in your property type and all that, but what does everybody say when you give them an offer that’s lower than what they want? Well, I’m just going to list it and I’ll just like, “How did that work for you last time?”
I have the Trump card ready and then they’re like, “Yeah, you’re right. It didn’t work.” And I’m like, “Okay, cool. Did you have a counter in mind?” So it makes it like a really easy transition into getting that deal. We pulled deals from that list all the time.

Chris Arnold:
Man, I love it. Just some great practical lists and to consider right there, I guarantee people listening haven’t thought a couple of those.

Ryan Dossey:
Can I nerd out for like two seconds?

Chris Arnold:
Yeah, I was to say, I was going to let you go like, come on with this last point because I know you got one. If you’re listening and we’re doing video right now, he’s like [crosstalk 00:23:04].

Ryan Dossey:
Rubbing my hands.

Chris Arnold:
What do you got?

Ryan Dossey:
So this is how I’ve built all of my companies, and I think what’s contributed to most of my deals. I’m not going to give the specifics. I just want to give the concept so people’s… Like kind of the wheels get turning. The other reason we market branded is once somebody lands on my website, I’m then able to remarket to them digitally. So when I’m marketing to somebody, they get a piece of mail. Whether they call me or not, if they go to my website, they click on my Facebook page, they interact with me digitally at all. I’m then adding them to value ad retargeting campaigns where they’re seeing me and my staff at the closing table, us walking through projects.
I’ve over a hundred pieces of copy written designed to add value. I feel like a lot of investors are like the skeezy guy at prom that’s like, “Hey, come home with me.” Our approach is more like, “Hey, you look nice tonight and we’re going to hit you with like 300 other compliments first.” So when we go to meet with sellers, there’s almost this celebrity shell shock of like, “Oh my gosh, you’re the guy from the internet.” Because they’ve seen all of the ads that have my acquisition staff in them.
So on top of that, if a letter costs me a dollar, I can get back in front of somebody digitally for a few pennies. A typical seller when they start to engage with my company is going to see me anywhere from 2 to 300 times in the first 30 days. They know who I am. They know what I do versus my competition that’s like, “Oh, I really hope they call off this one Hail Mary expired notice picture postcard. There we go.”

Chris Arnold:
Dude, love it. Absolutely love it, man. Absolutely love it. So I’m listening, right? I’m like, “Dude, this Ryan cat is kind of cool. I like this guy.” If people want to just follow you, again, everybody loves free info, where can they follow you? Are you an IG guy, YouTube guy?

Ryan Dossey:
Instagram. Instagram all day long. Instagram and YouTube. But I’m super active. My thought is if I’m going to be online. I should be reachable. So folks have questions, feel free to hit me up online.

Chris Arnold:
That’s cool. And a couple of things you gave is nuggets today and people might be interested in circling back around. First of all, if they’re interested in Call Porter, they’re like, “Hey, I’ve been trying to find a good third-party company to send this to, where do they find that at?

Ryan Dossey:
Yeah, literally just callporter.com. We’re actually in the process of redoing our website and our pricing is actually cheaper than it currently is on there. So just schedule a free demo with our staff and we’ll get you squared away.

Chris Arnold:
And then I know you Ballpoint as well, so I want to make sure I hit on that because one of the other reasons you’re really good at direct mail is because you help people do direct mail if they want to outsource too. So if I’m listening going, “Dude, this Ryan guy, I like for him to take over my campaigns. I don’t feel like messing with this myself,” how do they find you there?

Ryan Dossey:
Yeah. So ballpointmarketing.com or if you follow me personally, I share stuff from them all the time. But what’s different is these aren’t like printed. We have robots that physically hold the pens and handwrite in cursive. So it’s [crosstalk 00:26:05].

Chris Arnold:
You showed me a video of this, by the way, which was super cool to see-

Ryan Dossey:
It’s really cool.

Chris Arnold:
… robotic handwriting on these letters. It was really cool.

Ryan Dossey:
You can get all the other points right, but you’ve got to send something that’s different from what other people are doing. So we’ll even do like full color customs for the market for the client. But we’ll have sellers call us that are like, “I’m a retired school teacher and I don’t want to sell my house, but your handwriting sure is pretty.” And it’s like, “Gee, thanks.” Right? I don’t have the heart to tell him it’s a robot in a warehouse.

Chris Arnold:
A robot. That’s great, man. And one of the cool things, one of the postcards you showed me, the thing I like about you doing is like everyone sends a yellow, pink, blue, whatever postcards. You’re utilizing comic, like a comic book type postcard. They’re super well-designed. They’re super catchy and dated. If they came in a mailbox, it would stick out among everything because it’s bright, it’s cartoonish, it’s colorful. So maybe hit on that just real quick because I thought that was cool to see that you guys are doing the comic type stuff.

Ryan Dossey:
Yeah. So we wanted something that was different where we could highlight the various benefits of working with an investor. So it’s like a seven postcard sequence. But the funny thing that I normally get with that is like, “Oh seniors aren’t going to like this.” Comics were popular in the ’40s and ’50s. That was their heyday. Now with Marvel, everybody is into comics. It’s kind of funny because one of our postcard images is this girl that kind of looks like Katy Perry.
One of our clients is like, “She’s too sexy. People are not going to like this.” People love it just because it’s so different than anything else they’re getting that it stands out. And that was really our goal. We want it to be something that somebody gets and they’re like, “Hmm, I haven’t seen this before.” And that’s what we’re getting.

Chris Arnold:
That’s cool, man. Well, Ryan, bro, appreciate your time. You came in. Again, our goal is always to the tribe to bring you guys this because I’m a practical guy. I want to finish a podcast and be like, “I can implement that. I can research that. Ooh, that was really good food for thought when we processed that.” So Ryan you brought today [inaudible 00:28:03]. I so much appreciate it. So thanks for coming on, buddy.

Ryan Dossey:
Absolutely, dude. Thanks for having me. This was fun.

Chris Arnold:
Of course. Man, we might have to do this again. I know there’s a lot of value that was added. And to the rest of you guys, as always thank you so much for joining us. Until next time, you will catch us soon when we add more value. Talk to you later.

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