Every person wants the same thing for their money. And that is to grow it in the right direction. Investing in real estate is the best way to do that. There are just so many doors that you can open when you take your time and start learning its ins and outs. By following a thorough due diligence process, you’ll achieve financial freedom in a flash!
Joining us today is our very own Wholesaling Inc. student Paul Riley. Paul is relentless in his pursuit and is passionate about sharing his real estate knowledge with people. In this episode, he will be dropping bombs on how he developed an action plan that led him to make six figures in his first seven months in business.
The 4 Week Action Plan That Led To Massive Results From The Land Down Under With Paul Riley
Every person wants the same thing for their money. And that is to grow it in the right direction. Investing in real estate is the best way to do that. There are just so many doors that you can open when you take your time and start learning its ins…
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I’ve got a good episode with one of my older students from 2021. His name is Paul Riley. Our conversation went all over the place. We talked about feelings and emotions and getting started as a wholesaler, living in Australia and trying to wholesale in Australia. The conversation goes all over the place, but it was a good one. If you need that motivation, if you’re somebody who’s getting started or looking to get started in wholesaling, this is the episode for you.
I see this all the time. I talk to a lot of aspiring wholesalers. They want to build wealth by real estate investing and get into wholesaling, but the problem is they live somewhere where wholesaling doesn’t make sense. Maybe the prices are too high or too low and real estate doesn’t hold that much value. It is understandable that you think you need to live where you invest or invest in your backyard because real estate is a tangible object.
You think you need to be able to touch it. Most investors that I see settle for those problems in their backyard or they don’t do it at all, but it doesn’t have to be this way. In this episode, you’re going to see that Paul took action. He started when he lived all the way in Australia. He didn’t even know where he was going to end up living, but he took action anyway. He picked a virtual market and went after it.
I’m here to show you that you can take that same virtual approach. You will be very surprised at how easy it is. I’m here to show you that you don’t need to live where you invest and you can have that location and time freedom that you desire. I am so excited for you to read this episode. Make sure that you share it with a friend or anyone that you think might benefit from reading. Let’s get into the episode. Paul, welcome to the show.
Thanks, Lauren. It’s great to be here.
I’m so glad to finally see you. It has been a long time since I last saw you when you were in my Virtual Investing Mastery group. Catch us up. What has been going on with you?
I did your coaching program from about January to June of 2021, which was awesome. I wouldn’t have been able to have any of my success without you, for sure. I did a number of wholesale deals over 2021, but now I’m getting into note investing and using that as my asset class for building cashflow and financial freedom.
I always say that wholesaling is the gateway drug to real estate investing. It’s cool to see a lot of people start with wholesaling and then end up in different avenues. Note investing is not one that often you see, but that’s super interesting. Let’s go back. When did you first start wholesaling?
February 2021 is when I started, jumped into it and joined your program.
You were brand new when you started.
The first deal is with you and everything.
Wholesaling has a low barrier of entry where it didn’t have any capital, but it did have time and effort.
What made you want to get started in real estate investing?
As far as wholesaling, I like the low barrier of entry where I didn’t have any capital but did have time and effort. I like how it was a low barrier where I could jump into it. I love how the potential is limitless with wholesaling. Whatever you can get the margin to be, that’s what you can make. I love the model and knew what was possible with it. That’s why I chose that.
How did you even hear about wholesaling?
It was Wholesaling Inc. years ago. I was living overseas in Australia. I was working a mundane job, studying and doing other stuff as well. This certain job was a lot of data entry, filing and everything. I was like, “I’ve heard you can invest in real estate. I don’t even know what that means. I’m bored.” I typed in, “Real estate investing podcast.” I came across a couple and eventually came across Wholesaling Inc. After listening to a bunch, I was like, “This is an awesome model. I can do this. I want to try it.”
That’s how I did it from the podcast. I tried doing it in Australia because I was so excited about it and I was pumped to do it. I had zero success over there. There are different rules, everything like that too and taxes. Nobody even knows it’s a thing over there. I was talking to people and it’s a whole different ball game, but it was good practice anyway. As soon as I moved over here in January or February of 2021, I hit the ground running with virtual coaching.
What made you go straight to virtual right out the bat?
I liked the idea of being able to either expand into different markets or go into any market that I wanted. I didn’t want to be necessarily confined to where I was living. For a time, when I was still in Australia, I didn’t know where in the US I would be moving to. I knew that if I set up my business virtually, it didn’t matter where we ended up moving. I could do what I wanted to do.
You’re the traveler or the vagabond. You don’t want to be stuck in one spot.
It seems like that because I lived overseas for a while but not really. I lived over there for almost seven years. I used to be from this area and I don’t see myself moving anytime soon. I’m happy to be in the USA and be living life.
You’re not like Tim Ferriss’ The 4-Hour Workweek. He travels the world, but you can be if you want to because you’re doing everything virtually. You’re younger. Are you working a full-time job at the time that you got started and moved back from Australia?
I wasn’t. I didn’t have any job or anything lined up. I’m married. My wife had a full-time job. It was an awesome opportunity. It was scary because I didn’t know if I could do it at all. I was like, “This is a big transition in life. I’m going to take the leap and give it everything I have.” I jumped into it full-time.
Was your wife on board or was she skeptical at all?
I love her so much. She was on board, which is awesome. She was like, “This better work. I’m on board.” She was super supportive the whole time, even before my first deal. That allowed me to have even more confidence in it.
Do you have any advice for someone in your shoes who is married but is maybe like, “I don’t want to go down this track of working Corporate America? I want to try something new.” How do you have that discussion with your partner and get them on board?
It would be discovering where you want to be in life together. For me, real estate is a way. I’m heading towards financial freedom, which ties into other dreams with us and what we believe we’re called to do here on Earth. It ties into our life vision. If you want to have that conversation with your spouse, figure out the why behind everything. If you can get on the same page there, you can maybe find the path where maybe wholesaling or real estate is the way that one of you needs to go or both of you and work it out that way.
At the time when I started real estate investing, I did have a corporate job. I’m not married now, but my husband at the time had a corporate job as well. We were both corporate salary people. We both had high expectations of what we wanted our life to look like. We wanted to be wealthy, have a nice house and send our kids to good schools. At the track we were going, we were at the mercy of our boss giving us the raise and us climbing up that corporate ladder. We decided, “One of us is going to be the one that takes the risk. The other one’s going to have the stability while the other one’s taking the risk.”
It happened to be me. I was the risk-taker. I was more entrepreneurial in my personality anyway. It made a ton of sense. That was similar. You start with, “Where do you want to be? Where do you see us in 10 to 15 years? What kind of house and car? Where do you want our kids to go to school?” Are we going to get there working here at this corporate job? Probably not. I like that approach. I feel like that’s not talked about enough because there are some people whose spouses are not on board.
They’re not saying that this is a bad thing. Everyone has their attitudes about entrepreneurialism and taking risks based on what they went through in their childhood and path. For example, if you had a father who always started up businesses and failed, you’re going to be like, “I want a stable job, benefits, and a pension. I don’t care if I make a ton of money. I want stability.” I do think that there are some people out there that have that bug and it hits us. In every job we go into, we’re like, “How do we own this company?”
I remember after listening to a bunch of Wholesaling Inc. podcasts sitting at my job in Australia. I knew I was going to be moving back to the US anywhere, but I remember sitting at my desk and being like, “This is going to be my last job. I hope I’m at least going to give it my biggest shot.” It has been working out so far.
It’s the power of visualization. There are two stories I want to share. I had read this quote. I don’t remember what book it was from, but they sometimes put a quote at the beginning of a chapter. There was this little longer one. It was a story of a man who survived the Holocaust and gave a speech. The whole theme of the speech was, “How did you survive the Holocaust?”
His advice or what he had said was, “I envisioned myself here giving this speech. That’s how I survived.” I’m like, “That can make me cry.” I took that seriously. It was about visualization, manifestation and getting this in your head. When you’re at your corporate job, you were like, “I’m visualizing the day that I quit this job. I walk out the door and shake my boss’ hand. The sun comes in.”
It’s easy from there.
The potential is limitless with wholesaling. It’s whatever you can get the margin to be, that’s what you can make.
You sail off from your yacht. As far as visualization, it’s important to talk about this because, honestly, you will never hit your goals if you don’t do this. If you don’t know where you’re going, you’re never going to get there. It was one of these where I got that déjà vu like, “I’ve seen this before,” moment or, “This is my dream. I’m living my dream.” One of my first jobs out of college was an internship. I was in college and then slightly out of college. It was an internship at a commercial real estate broker called Sperry Van Ness. They’re a nationwide brokerage.
I worked at the headquarters as an intern. The owner Rand Sperry was there. He’s a super inspirational guy. It was a commercial real estate brokerage. They would sell big buildings, office buildings and apartments. I was sitting in these broker calls. Every Monday, all the brokers would sit in. It was a company-wide Sperry Van Ness call where anybody would say what listings they were trying to sell. If they had a new building that was available to sell, they would say, “I’ve got a 26-unit in Indianapolis. The cap rate is 7%.”
They would say that and if any of the brokers in the room maybe had a client interested in that, then they can make that connection so that they would try to keep it all in Sperry. I would listen. As an intern, they let me do anything to learn. They were like, “If you want to sit in those calls, you can.” I purposely would go sit in those calls. I was the only intern that would do that. I looked like an idiot. I didn’t belong. There were these guys in suits. They’re all men. They sound so smart.
They’re saying words I don’t understand. I’m writing down notes so I can google what those words meant. All I kept thinking was, “I’m going to be the owner or the buyer of one of those buildings.” I wasn’t thinking I was going to be the broker. I was like, “I’m not going to be a broker. I’m going to be the owner of one of those buildings. I’m going to have a broker work for.” I’ve been on a hunt for a multifamily property. I’m in that mode now. Years into my real estate investing career, I’m finally like, “I want to go into commercial now. I’m ready to go back to my roots.”
Someone had mentioned it through a referral. A guy that works at a hedge fund was like, “I know of a 26-unit that’s for sale. My buddy has something to do with it. Let me connect you.” They sent me. It was listed by Sperry Van Ness. It’s a 26-unit. I was pinching myself. I was like, “Full circle, here I am. I am making my freaking dreams come true.” Think big. You never realize the importance of a moment. That moment was so important in my brain. Somewhere in there, it planted a seed.
It never went away. You always remembered that and it snapped back years later.
Do you have a moment like that you can think of?
It was that desk moment. It wasn’t a profound thing, but it was real. I remember. I can still visualize what was on Excel on my computer, but I remember what it was like sitting at the desk. I remember thinking, “This is going to be my last job.” I was determined to make it work. I don’t know when I initially thought that because I was listening to the podcast at least a year before moving and starting under something.
It could have been 1 year, 6 months or a long time later. After doing a couple of deals, then I knew it was working. I had more leads in the pipeline. I don’t need a job because that was the worst-case scenario. It’s like, “If I can’t make this work within those first three months to get my first deal as you’ve talked about, then I’m going to have to get a job.” After my first few deals and I could see more on the horizon, I was like, “I remember that. That was my last job. I can keep doing this.”
You ended up joining a coaching program, mine specifically, right out of the gate. How long was it from starting your education? Take me through that timeline.
Is it from when I started my first deal?
When you started up with me on your first deal, take us through what you were doing, what was your first couple of weeks like and what was going through your head. Take us through that roller coaster of emotions.
There were a lot of emotions for sure. It kept oscillating between nervousness and excitement. In the beginning, get started with going through your modules, working on picking a market, looking at the different data points that you teach on how to pick a virtual market, joining Facebook groups in those different markets, trying to narrow it down, getting on the phone with potential JV partners and getting the feel from those people on what the market is like.
That was the first couple of weeks. It’s those types of things and getting the systems up like getting PropStream, BatchLeads for texting and things like that. It’s getting that stuff set up and the tools you need like virtual phone numbers and things like that. I started marketing through texting. The first few weeks were getting set up. I wasn’t talking to sellers yet and doing the moneymaking part, but it was still nerve-wracking like, “I’m doing this, but can I do this?” Those were the first steps.
It’s that stage of setting up. I’m proud of you that you only took four weeks. There are people that take six months to do that because they get into analysis paralysis. They don’t want to do it. They’re so nervous about taking action. They take a month to set up their website and phone numbers and learn how to pull a list. They take forever because they’re dragging out getting started because they’re terrified of talking to sellers on the phone. That’s all it is. It’s having that first conversation with the seller on the phone.
Good for you that you only took four weeks. If anybody is reading, if you’re taking longer than four weeks, what are you doing? Stop doing that. You’re now making excuses. It’s not that hard. Plow through it and check the list. I give you a list to check off in my program. Do it, pick up the phone, and then call your first seller phone call. How nervous were you with your first seller who had a property that you would make an offer? Do you pace back and forth and pretend that you’re talking to this seller?
Absolutely. I’m the type of personality where it’s like having a scheduled phone call holds my day hostage. I don’t know if you’re like into Enneagrams or anything. I’m a Type 9. That confrontation stuff or those potentially conflictive scenarios doesn’t jive with me. I feel like it was an extra barrier to get over. I remember sending the texts and she’s like, “I’m interested,” and then getting on the phone with her. The first phone call wasn’t too bad because I got the info about the house or something.
I remember the second phone call when I figured out what I was going to offer. That was super nerve-wracking. She didn’t like my offer. It was after dinner because of the time zones and everything. I remember being at the dinner table and not being that hungry. I was so nervous because I knew I had this phone call that was going to happen concerning rents. I was checking my phone. It’s a journey.
Now, do you get nervous about giving seller offers?
Not really. There’s a twinge of it for sure, but it’s not the I-can’t-eat-my-dinner type.
It gets easier with practice. I always like to think of what’s going on in your brain and body chemistry. You get in this fight or flight mode for some reason. You think the seller is like a tiger.
They’re thousands of miles away on their phones. They can’t do anything to you.
If they stop paying, the way you protect yourself is by having the ability to foreclose.
They can’t hurt you. That took a lot of practice slamming the phones until I broke through it and I didn’t have it. It could be awkward. Something that I would always struggle with is when I would give an offer, I always felt like I had to justify it as soon as it came out of my mouth. That’s the worst thing to do in a negotiation because you’re telling them it’s a lowball after you start justifying that. You say it with confidence. I develop my script. I have a very specific seller script.
It’s all based on me avoiding getting yelled at because I’ve gotten yelled at so much at working the California market. The lowballs that we had to give out here were so low. Sellers would be like, “That is insulting.” I developed my initial seller script and how I gave my offers with the idea, “How can I best say this, so I don’t get yelled at?” Every time a conversation would go bad, I would write down three different ways to say it again where it could have come off better.
Here’s a pro tip. Instead of offering a price like, “Mr. Seller, what I was going to offer you is a $125,000,” offer them a price range at first. It is such a smoother way. The way you say it is, “Mr. Seller, it looks like properties like yours are going to other investors for between $100,000 and $135,000. Does that make sense to you?” Hear what they say. You didn’t even make the offer yet.
You’re testing the water and feeling them out. Don’t even give them your offer yet until that price range makes sense. As soon as they’re like, “I could see that because you’re right. That comp went for this and this comp went for that. Now that you bring that up, I get it,” and then you go, “Hold on. Let me call you right back. I’m going to talk to my partner and get you an offer.” You call back five minutes later and say it’s $125,000.
It’s such an easier way to say that. I had a big problem with this. I used to give the offer and then I would keep talking. I would start justifying and say, “I’m going to offer you $125,000, but I’m going to take it as is. I’m going to take it with your tenant, do that and pay all cash.” Obviously, I look like I’m lowballing you because I’m already trying to sell you. I purposely would say the number and then cover my mouth with my hand. I would cover my mouth, so I shut up.
It’s a trick to the trade right there. Let me know what you think about this. Sometimes at least in my experience, it seems like it’s not helpful to build up the offer, which I’ve done. It is like, “This offer is all cash. It’s as-is and all those things. There are no commissions. We cover the closing costs.” You’re all of that. I feel like I’ve done that many times, which makes it more intense holding up to that number. It’s like a bomb. The way you described it is a much better way.
How many times have you been sold something? A salesman does that. I’m trying to think of getting your car detailed or something. The guy is like, “We’re going to wash the leather real good. We’re going to wash the sides, your carpets, and that.” You’re like, “What is it? I know what a car detail is.”
You know they’re coming in for a close. They’re like, “If we could do this.” I’m like, “They’re coming in for the closing line.”
Be a boss and be like, “We’re buying homes in the area. I bought other homes for that. I’m not out of left field here. The houses in your neighborhood are going from this to this.” If they sound like they’re shocked by it, give, “Here are three comps.” If you don’t have those three comps, you’re lowballing. Your offer is following some 70% rule that shouldn’t exist anyway. If you can’t find comps to support your narrative, your offer price is probably pretty off. It’s crazy. You came a long way. How many wholesales did you do in 2021? Tell me, how did 2021 end up for you?
It ended up well. I believe it was six deals in 2021, but overall, it was a little over $100,000 in revenue. They were great-sized deals to me. That’s net to my business. I was pumped about that.
That’s a good first year, honestly.
I was surprised too. When I hit that $100,000 mark, I was like, “This works.”
That makes me feel good. There’s always this pressure for me, being on the educator’s side. I hope that it worked well for you. I sleep better at night when I hear your stories. I always tell everybody, “Can you let me know if this worked out or even if it didn’t and we will make it work out?” It sounds like you then jumped into a new investing technique, note trading. That sounds pretty interesting. What are you doing there?
I’m buying performing notes using other people’s money or investor capital. A performing note is a mortgage that’s attached to the property, instead of how a rental gets rental income and you get income from the tenant. Here, the homeowner pays me their mortgage payment each month. You still get the cashflow, but you don’t get a lot of the headaches from property management that’s asset class.
Do note investors like you go national or do you focus on a territory?
It’s more national. There are some markets that are better than others. One big thing is the state that it’s in. Each state has different foreclosure laws. If they stop paying, the way you protect yourself from that is you have the ability to foreclose. In some states, it could take as long as two years, which would kill the deal. It wouldn’t be profitable, whereas I closed on one in Michigan. Michigan is a lot shorter. It can only take six months to take the property back. That makes a lot more sense if you have to go that route. Markets are different, but the whole nation is wide open.
There’s a lot of potential. I have a friend who’s in it. I bought a house from him. It’s one that he took back. Its ends story was great, but there was a lot of drama with the foreclosure and I got tied into it and stuff. It’s an amazing way to capture a lot of equity in homes. It’s an amazing strategy. For a virtual investor, it ties into what you’re doing. That’s super cool.
Paul, thank you so much for sharing your story. You gave a lot of good advice and inspiration to anyone who’s reading. If anybody is reading and wants to learn more about what you’re doing in the note business or has questions about getting started, how could they find you? Are you on Instagram or anything?
I am on Instagram. The best way to get ahold of me would be through my website. It’s BlackArrowAssets.com. There’s a button there. You can book a call with me there. I’m happy to talk. I believe my contact info is on there as well. Reach out and I’m happy to help however I can.
Thank you so much for coming. Thank you so much for reading. If you are interested in learning how to virtual wholesale the way Paul did, I want to help you. Make sure you check out www.VirtualInvestingMastery.com, where you can learn more about the program. Thanks so much for reading. I’ll see you next time.
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About Lauren Hardy
Lauren Hardy is a Virtual Investing expert and Real Estate influencer who owns multiple companies in the real estate industry including real estate investment, coaching, and software companies. She is also a Wholesaling Inc coach and co-host of the Wholesaling Inc Podcast.
Her experience in the last decade has been focused on real estate investing and creating products and services to serve the real estate investing community. If you are interested in investing in real estate virtually, house flipping, or virtual landlording, Lauren’s your girl.