Posted on: March 17, 2021

Today’s show is a treat for the listeners as it features a new strategy to boost your wholesaling business, and that is how to do Lands! Our guest, Brent Bowers, the new coach of Wholesaling Inc., will talk about this massive opportunity to make money in real estate.

Brent Bowers is the current CEO of Zech Buys Houses LLC. Under the brand are the following: Vacant Land of the Free, discounted houses Colorado Springs, Rent2Own Colorado, and Co-Working & Shared Space, all under the brand. He is also a Land Coach at The Land Sharks. He used to work as an Army Officer for over Eight years and ventured into real estate to enjoy more time with his family and financial freedom to support them.

In this episode, Brent Bowers will give more details to the Top Five reasons why land is the best way to make money in real estate.

Get excited to make more money in real estate through the land. Make sure to indulge in this episode to know the details from the expert!

Key Takeaways

  • Top 5: The simplicity of the land
  • The percentage of relief in removing the house and people in it from the equation in wholesaling
  • Comparison between land deal vs. traditional wholesaling
  • Top 4: Land, creating geographical freedom
  • Top 3: Virtually no competition on land
  • What resources he used to look at Land deals
  • Why people steer away from Lands for him
  • How often he goes up against another investor on land
  • Top 2: More time freedom from land
  • A glimpse of how he does Land deals to create long-term passive income
  • His bread and butter Lands and profile of buyers
  • His Land business during the Pandemic
  • The average of what he is producing off Land deals
  • Top 1: Financial freedom from land
  • How to sign up for the course on wholesaling land

RESOURCES:

If you are Ready to Explode Your Wholesaling Business, Click here to Book a Free Strategy Session with me right now!

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Episode Transcription

Chris Arnold:
Welcome to the Wholesaling Inc podcast. I’m your host, Chris Arnold. Excited that you are with us today as always. Thanks for joining us. I’ve got a treat for you. It’s always exciting, in my opinion, to hear about a fresh strategy. I’m a person, you guys know me doing radio, I think that the majority is wrong. And when I come across somebody that’s doing something kind of off in left field by themselves, I like to call that person an anomaly, an outlier, to utilize that language. That’s someone I pay close attention to because I found a lot of times that person that’s innovating tends to kind of be out there on their own. And so it’s a day I’m excited to bring on Brent Bowers, one of the newest coaches to the Wholesaling Inc group. Love to have him. He’s got a huge history with us. We even did some Radio together, Brent, as well. So you and I have worked together on that. And now we get to work together on talking about what you’re bringing to the table today. And that’s how to do land. Welcome to the show, buddy.

Brent Bowers:
Thanks for having me, Chris. Yeah. So blessed to be here. Radio has been an absolute blessing to us. We literally just bought a piece of land in the last couple of days with Radio and my whole mentality is never follow the herd. Be a little different than everyone else.

Chris Arnold:
I absolutely agree. And this is cool that the Radio and the land piece, et cetera, are kind of all coming together. So I’m excited to kick back today and learn from you. And people that listen to me know, man, I like to come in, ask the real questions, break this down and get some feedback. So here’s how we’re going to tackle this. This is what you’re going to walk away today with. I came in, I said, “Brent, I want you to tell me literally the top five things, like straight from the gut that you love about land. And let’s give like a five, four, three, two, one countdown on what this looks like. And through that, I’ll come in and just throw some questions at you about what about this? What about that?”
So that’s what you guys are going to walk away with today is talking about land, this opportunity, and on top of that, really, what are the best benefits? Because that’s how I like to look at things. Like, give me really the top few things I need to consider if I’m going to take a look at this new process or program or whatever it looks like. So man, let’s jump into the meat, man. Are you ready?

Brent Bowers:
I’m ready.

Chris Arnold:
All right. So, number five. I love this one. This is right after my own heart for you. You love land because of simplicity. What does that mean? Simplicity? What are we talking about here? Why is this something that you really appreciate about land?

Brent Bowers:
You might find this funny, but I’m just a simple dude. I like to keep things as simple as possible. I don’t like complex, complicated things. Business is already an intellectual sport, intellectual game. I’m not good at chess or checkers, so I like to keep things simple. I don’t want to have to think a lot about things. I want to just kind of pick an asset, buy it and sell it, and keep it simple. No moving parts, no houses, no nothing. So just a simple dude making a living off land. So that’s probably why it’s my top five.

Chris Arnold:
[crosstalk 00:04:09] This is what I want to know. What… Again, we can wholesale a house. We could do a lot of other types of real estate. In comparison, what I want to know is what makes bland simpler than these other aspects of investing?

Brent Bowers:
I would say first reason why it’s so simple as there’s no house on it. There’s no leaky roof. There’s no foundation to repair. It’s just a piece of clean dirt that nothing’s been done to it. So it’s not a lot of due diligence, a lot of research. I can check this from wherever in the world that I’m at. So it’s just, there’s no bedbugs or stinky cat pee or a herd of cats. Like these type things that I’ve seen when you buy houses.

Chris Arnold:
Why did you keep saying cats? Because I do feel like that’s part of the industry we’re running. We’ve dealt with a lot of cat issues. So I’m just laughing that you went there because I can’t tell you how many houses we bought that, literally, the subject of a cat or multiple cats came up.
But I think this is an interesting point. I want to ask it this way. If you do a wholesale deal or a land deal. And again, we’re not just wholesaling. You’re going to get into your strategy, which is amazing. We’re talking about long-term play passive income. But I want to know this. What percentage of the headache and complications you think you remove outside of the deal if you actually remove the house itself from the equation?

Brent Bowers:
So great question. I’ve wholesaled over a hundred houses, and bought and sold and fixed up houses. And you know, the funny story about the cats. I can’t tell you how many houses that they left the cats in it. I’m just like what is going on with cats? If we walked into a house and we smell a cat, we knew it was big money.
Going back to land. What made it easier to Wholesale? There was not a lot of inspections. There was literally no inspections. They didn’t have to get their foundation guy out there, their roofer out there, their electrician out there. There’s nothing to burn down while someone’s sleeping in it. And we’ve had things come back on us after closing as far as liens and un-pulled permits. Or un-permitted work, I should say. So we don’t have to worry about that with land.

Chris Arnold:
I feel like if I could put a stat on this, again, I’m just here interviewing you. Right? And this is all going through my brain. I honestly feel like you’re removing somewhere between around 80% of the headache just by the fact that you’re not dealing with the actual structure of the house. You’re literally just dealing with the land. And if I go back to the thousands of deals that I’ve done, how many of my problems stem from just the house alone. Right? And not just the house, but the people that were actually dwelling in the house. Right?
So you either have a physical house problem or you have a tenant slash human being problem. And with land, you’re not getting any of those because you don’t have a house and you don’t have someone living in that house. And I’m like, I really am like listening going, “You’re absolutely right. That’s got to be a much simpler deal.” I’m buying in on that. I’m convinced just from a common sense standpoint of what you’re saying. Is there anything else that you feel like makes it simpler outside of the fact that there’s not a structure in comparison to other deals? Anything else?

Brent Bowers:
We had a very good assessment of that, Chris. And you talked about people, and I want to drive people home just a little bit more. There’s so much less emotion when it comes to selling land because when people have never laid their head there at night, there’s no tenants that are squatting on the land. To this day, I have not had anybody squatting on the land that I purchased that I know about.

Chris Arnold:
Yeah, that’s a great point. You are removing the emotion out of it because it’s not a home. It’s not a house. There’s not memories there. I totally agree with you. So you’re removing the structure and you’re removing the emotion. And I just want to know what does a land deal feel like versus a traditional wholesale. Like in your mind, are you like, “Dude, this is just night and day different experience.”

Brent Bowers:
Yes, it absolutely is because I found a way to get paid for many, many years on each one of our land transactions. They’re not just simpler, and we’re going to get into that. They’re way less complex. But it also pays me longer. And it’s just so much more fascinating to know that every time my team does a deal, it’s going to be a longer process of payments coming in to us.

Chris Arnold:
Absolutely. So there’s a residual aspect that you’re creating here that we’re going to get into. So I like it. Okay. So I’m listening. I’m like… If I’m putting myself in the shoes of someone that’s listening right now, I’m like, “Okay, I buy that. I buy that this is a simpler deal. Common sense is telling you with what you said. So I’m in agreement.” So let’s go to the next one. The fourth… Again, we’re moving backwards through this process, like five, four, three, two, one. Number four is the fact that it creates geographical freedom. So talk to us about this point and why you love this, and define what we’re talking about when you say geographical freedom.

Brent Bowers:
So I got out of the military May, 2018. I was in the army for eight and a half years, and I probably only slept in my bed almost four of those years, maybe four of those years. So I was gone over half the time. We were always training, always deployed, always in the field, always gone, always away, family’s missing me, creates a lot of problems at home. So I wanted a business that I didn’t have to be tied to a desk, a location, a home, anything. And it allows me the geographic freedom because we’re not going to the land we’re purchasing. Yes, in the beginning, I used to think… It was a limiting belief that I had to go to all the pieces of land that I purchased. Well, it hit me one day because after the fifth time, I said, “Hey, honey. Emily.” Emily is my wife. I was like, “We should keep this piece of land. We could build a cabin on it one day.” And she was like, “How many cabins do we need?” So from that day forward, I never went to any more land.

Chris Arnold:
That’s interesting. So you can do deals outside of your primary city, because this is a much easier, let’s say, piece of real estate to look at, because fundamentally you don’t have a house on it. So you can buy all over and you don’t actually even need to go out there and visit. I imagine that you get what you need probably by just like Google earth, right?

Brent Bowers:
Google earth. That’s right. And I-

Chris Arnold:
I’m serious. I’m asking, are you primarily using Google earth to look at your deals?

Brent Bowers:
Yes. And if there’s any questions, we find someone on Craigslist. We find them on buy, sell groups in that particular city. Or there’s a great service called wegolook.com that will even take pictures of the place for me while they’re there, and video, and even put a sign out saying for sale. So we sometimes get buyers before we even own the land to purchase this land. And I actually had to learn this the hard way, looking at land, after we bought a five acre junkyard. And it’s not a big deal because we sold it. We sold it on terms. It was just some extra icing on the cake for the buyer because they actually collected car parts. So it’s like, there’s literally a buyer for every piece of land, too.

Chris Arnold:
Absolutely, man. I think, dude, another huge point. I totally understand the fact that if I’m listening and I’m like, “I live in a city that has a lot of competition, et cetera. It’s a difficult market. I can jump over into another market pretty easily. And I might be able to do that easier than if I was doing houses because land requires less of an evaluation from an inspection standpoint.” So I get it. I understand that geographical freedom would be something that you love about land versus other types of investment. Okay.
So let’s go to number three. I love this one because this is one that I believe is one of the most important points about anything that you do, right? And that is the fact that when you’re dealing with land, there’s virtually no competition. So I imagine you’re saying everybody’s going after single family properties, but it’s kind of like Radio. Everyone is overlooking all these pieces of land. Is that where you’re going with this?

Brent Bowers:
It’s so true. Everyone’s running after, once again, the dirty old stinky cat pee houses and they’re completely missing the land. They’re just missing out on it. They drive by it every day and they don’t realize… I would say the reason why most people completely miss land is they have no clue how to make money with it. Like, they don’t see-

Chris Arnold:
Say that again, because I think you nailed it. Why are they overlooking land?

Brent Bowers:
So they drive by this gold every single day that they don’t even look at because they have no clue how to make money on it. There’s no structure. There’s no storage unit to rent out. There’s no house to rent out. There’s no apartment, no trailer, nothing for someone to lay their head at night, to bring the people problems in with the emotional problems and this and that, and non-paying rent and squatters. But they don’t realize there’s a way to make money on this land without the structure, the problems, the people, the emotions.

Chris Arnold:
Man, I think you probably nailed it. It was the same I found with Radio. People steered by it because they didn’t understand it. And what I’m saying is I love the fact when you find something like that, because what you’ve done is you said, “Hey, here’s this thing over here, land, that people don’t understand. And rather than steering away from it, I’m going to get in, I’m going to learn a process on how to make money. And when I crack the code on this, I’m going to be over here by myself, picking up all these deals.”
So let me ask this question. If we’re talking wholesaling a house, we might say, hey, on average, when I go and try to do a deal, I go up between three to five other wholesalers. And let’s say that that’s going to happen the majority of the time. How often are you going up against another investor on land? Like, what percentage of the time?

Brent Bowers:
As far as I’m tracking, never.

Chris Arnold:
Like, literally, you’ve not gone up against another investor on land yet?

Brent Bowers:
So here’s-

Chris Arnold:
It’s that, like… When we say there’s virtually no competition, and then what you’re saying is there’s actually no competition.

Brent Bowers:
Yeah. Let me add this disclaimer. If I go into a county and I pick a new… I like to call it my playground. And we mail this playground and we have someone get back to us and say, “Hey, I don’t know what’s going on. I’ve gotten three or four of these letters from other people.” I would say that’s really the only time that I’m going against other people, other competition, other investors. Now, is that person sending that letter out going to follow up like we are? Or have a system in place to follow up and touch base three months later? Where they randomly text us, like yesterday on our team meetings said, “Hey, is that $10,000 offer still good?” And that’s a $40,000 lot we’re going to buy a 10,000. So, hardly ever. Let me just put that disclaimer, hardly ever. We’re not even tracking it because it’s not even happening.

Chris Arnold:
That’s amazing. And I think if you’re listening, you’re going, “Wow. That would be a really nice position to be in.” To not feel like… It’s a knuckle fight every time I get into a deal because I gotta increase my price to beat out the competition. And it’s just a good feeling. The longer I’ve been in business, Brent, the more… And you know who talks about this? A great book by the way, which is called Zero to One by Peter Thiel, he’s the guy that invested into Facebook and a lot of other companies. Sold PayPal. He would argue that one of the biggest misconceptions in business is the fact that competition is good. He would tell you that the number one thing he has always strived for is to be out of as much competition with anyone as possible, because why do businesses go out of business? Because of competition.
So it is not a good thing, although we’ve kind of been sold that. And so I agree, man. You’re over here with the Peter Thiel type of mentality, and it’s the same that I have as well. And that is if I can get into something and, fundamentally, almost have a monopoly on it, be the only one, man, that’s a great business to run. Because I would imagine you got a lot of room to make mistakes, right? Even though you’re not intentionally making them, you got a lot of flexibility, a lot of room to shake over here because you’re not getting beat up by a bunch of other competitors. Right?

Brent Bowers:
It’s very self-correcting. And we’re offering so low. We’re offering oftentimes 20, 30, 40, 50 cents on the dollar. And there’s a lot of room for error, margin for error. It’s very self-correcting when you get something that little at that low of a price. So it’s absolutely right. When you get something to that rock bottom dirt sheet and things come up, it’s not such a big deal.

Chris Arnold:
So, dude, I get it. Virtually no competition. Constantly looking for that. I hope as you’re listening, whether you decide to do land or anything else, if you hear the fact that there’s virtually no competition about something, it’s something you should honestly listen to, because somebody is innovating something. And man, if you can be on the front side of it, it’s just super valuable because there is a wave to ride before everyone else hears about it and does it, and it’s going to happen with everything over time. And so, man, I love the fact that this is a thing that you love about it.
So let’s go to number two, time freedom. How does doing land give me more freedom of time? Help me understand this.

Brent Bowers:
You know what? I hate to disrupt number two, but before I say that, I had a thought. I wanted to expand on something.

Chris Arnold:
[crosstalk 00:17:21] go back, baby. We can jump.

Brent Bowers:
Let’s go back-

Chris Arnold:
Let’s take one step back. What do you got?

Brent Bowers:
You mentioned competition and stress. Like, I got to get back to the seller really quick because someone else is going to beat me to it, beat me to the offer. I have to pay more to get it.
In 2016 when I was just starting this, and I’m still practicing. Like, I’m very new to this. I’m still a practitioner. I’m still buying and selling land with my team daily. But I remember, in 2016, I had such a successful mailing. I must have received nine or ten LOLs. I call them “LOLs,” land offer letters, that I had sent out to people at 20 cents on the dollar. And I wasn’t going… I started at 20 because I wanted to see if I could throw that hook in the water without any bait, or are hardly any bait, and catch a big fish with it. And I would add bait if I needed to.
So I started at 20 cents on the dollar, and I got like nine LOLs back, land offer letters. I was so anxious because I was still working my full-time job. We just had our second… Or, yeah. Our second baby at that time. So I had a lot going on. So I knew I couldn’t get back to all these properties. And I had just hired my acquisition manager. So we were still working together and kind of working out some kinks, and she’s amazing now. She’s still with me. But I just put those LOLs in my desk drawer and got back to them whenever I felt like it. And I probably only missed out on none of those deals.

Chris Arnold:
That’s interesting. So you’re not under the pressure of urgency that wholesaling creates around properties because you don’t have the competition, which gives you a little bit more of a luxury to kind of kick back a little bit. And it’s not always a fire drill to try to get a deal done, which is nice. Because I feel like for a lot of us, we always say, well, “The name of the game is speed.” Right? But it’s true. But the name of the game is speed when you have competition. So the name of the game is not speed when you remove competition. So let’s just understand that the reason the game is named that is because it’s saturated to some extent. And so I love this fact of land, that you’re able to kick back a little bit, which is interesting. Okay. Now I’m glad you landed that point home. It’s good.
So let’s go back to the time of freedom, freedom of time. This is number two for you. And I was asking the question, how does land give you more freedom of time than any other type of deal, whether wholesale piece of property, or fix and flip, or name it, whatever it is?

Brent Bowers:
I’ll put it to you this way. I was trying to get out of a J-O-B that I literally felt like I had shackles on seven days a week. The weekend was just terrible for me when I did get a weekend because I would think about Monday morning, and all of the things I had to go through for the next five days and multiple meetings and 12, 13 hours on base. And I had a carrot in front of my face. So too, at the same time, all of these great benefits, time in service, was moving through the ranks fast. So I was afraid to get out because I was like, “Well, what if I don’t make it? Because I’m making great money where I’m at.”
So we backed it up to how do we get our time freedom? And we figured out where we were and we’re going to talk about this and financial freedom, too. But we figured out where we need to be for each one of our bills. So we looked at our bills like our mortgage payment, our car payment, our electric, our water, our this or that. And I’m kind of alluding to my number one. I kind of let the cat out of the bag, literally. We can just call this “the cat show”, I guess. But I knew that once I replaced all those bills with the land payment coming in… You know, first one, the smallest one, was the electric payment. $200 a month. Well, lo and behold, it’s funny that one of my first land notes was $400 a month. So I covered my electric and water and gas all at the same time with one land sell. And that paid me for over 12 months. [crosstalk 00:21:22] So that allowed me to-

Chris Arnold:
I’m listening. Right?

Brent Bowers:
Yeah.

Chris Arnold:
And I’m going, wait, wait, wait a sec. Is this not a transaction? Are we talking about passive income? So again, if we’re going here, let’s go here. Because with your land, what you’re doing is you’re setting up a structure in which you are getting paid month after month. So rather than doing a deal and getting paid one time, you’re doing a deal in getting paid again and again and again. Is that right?

Brent Bowers:
Exactly.

Chris Arnold:
I want to know, before we get to the financial freedom and time freedom which this provide, give us a little glimpse on how you’re doing a deal, because what you’re doing is you’re creating long-term passive income via land. So let’s talk about that, because if I’m listening, I’m going, “Wait.” Help me understand this.

Brent Bowers:
And that’s what I was getting to. I was actually getting to the time freedom. And that’s what allows me the time freedom. It’s because we set it up to be paid for three, five, ten. We were even doing notes now for 30 years. Some people think I’m crazy for doing that, but I will tell you, the banks are not stupid. They’ve got the biggest, nicest buildings in every city in every state in the United States. And it’s because they know that most people move every five to seven years. So what is in the first five to seven years of your mortgage? It’s all interest. So that’s why we’re toying with those on our bigger parcels of land.
But here’s how I set it up. We buy the land at a massive discount. We buy this land at a massive discount and we mark it for buyers the entire time where we’re in the process of this transaction, so that we have a buyer ready to take over and buy this land as soon as possible. Sometimes it’s for the amount, their down payment is for the amount that we paid for the land. So we’re literally profitable in 30 days, and sometimes day one. So we’re constantly marketing for these buyers that want to make payments on a piece of land. And we’re opening up our buyers list because most Americans think, “What’s it going to cost me each month?” They’re not walking around with 5, 10, 20, $50,000 to purchase a piece of land. But they can darn sure come up with five, six, seven, $800 a month for the next 72 months or 30 years or whatever, however long it takes for them to get this piece of land and just have their American dream. Have a place to go camping, take their kids and build a fire, and roast s’mores and you know, park their RV on it, build a cabin, you name it.
So that’s how we’re setting it up. We’re purchasing this land at a massive discount, and we’re turning around and marketing it to the world of buyers that can afford a monthly payment. And we’re putting this thing on a note that pays us for the next 5, 10 30 years. And that’s how I get time freedom.

Chris Arnold:
You fundamentally sell, or financing, the dirt to them.

Brent Bowers:
Exactly. And think about the F-150, the best-selling truck in America. It might not be the best truck in America, but it sells a lot because if you walk in the Ford to buy a vehicle, you’re walking out with a monthly payment and a brand new vehicle. So we kind of set it up the same model.

Chris Arnold:
Okay. So I love this. I love this. I got some questions. I want to break this down a little bit. Who buys this land from you on average? Is this truly the All-American family that wants to camp out and make some s’mores, or like, who’s generally buying this dirt from you? So who’s your avatar or… You know?

Brent Bowers:
Avatar. 90%, my bread and butter land is mostly on the outskirts of town. 30 to 45 minutes away from the Walmarts and the McDonald’s. I call that recreational land.

Chris Arnold:
Recreational land.

Brent Bowers:
It’s usually two, three, five acres. Now granted, let’s flip the coin. There’s also in-filled build-able lots. That’s usually in a city like Dallas Fort Worth or Colorado Springs or Denver. That stuff’s in high demand and I’m not getting away with an offer at 20 cents on the dollar. I usually have to be somewhere around 50 cents on the dollar or 49 cents on the dollar. And I have to send way more land offer letters. But when I get one of those, it’s a quick flip to a builder or a spec home builder, or that flipper that’s tired of smelling cat pee and he’s going to start his own house. So that’s, I would say about, maybe, really about 9% of my business.
I don’t really get cashflow on that. I get quick chunks of change that allows me to buy that recreational land that I love so much, that there’s not a lot of competition, and there’s tons of buyers. And who does this avatar look like? For a while there it was truck drivers for me. It was really weird. These guys would call in on my signs and be like, “Hey, I drive by this land every three months. I just want to own it. How do I buy it?” And then it turned into elderly retired grandparents, because I put an elderly retired lady in the land sales position. And guess who she connected with? Was elderly people. And they were buying this land for their grandchildren, their children. That way they can leave a legacy of something that will never go away.

Chris Arnold:
The American dream. Your avatar is somebody that wants a piece of the American dream, which is owning a good sized land because there’s freedom with that. There’s the fact that I can come in with this land and have more autonomy with what I can do with my life and my lifestyle versus living in a subdivision in track homes.

Brent Bowers:
Exactly.

Chris Arnold:
Your avatar are people that just want a piece of that American dream, that freedom. I would imagine COVID is really pushing this even harder because people are like, “I’m out of the city. This is craziness. I’m getting out into suburb area,” where you’re doing for recreational land. Is that the case? That is a hot time for it?

Brent Bowers:
My goodness. That’s so funny you mentioned that. Last year-

Chris Arnold:
It’s got to be. I know it is. I do Radio. We get a lot of outskirts deals. So I know that your answer to this is yes, that COVID is actually driving us even more.

Brent Bowers:
That’s where most of our deals are coming from. And that’s why this Radio works so well with land, because it’s always on the outskirts.

Chris Arnold:
It’s on the outskirts.

Brent Bowers:
So, COVID. I got a story about that, man. So February of last year we went and spent a ton of money on a lake house. Come back in March, took about three and a half weeks off, and I find out about this thing called COVID-19. And I was kind of living under a rock, didn’t know what the heck that was. And I just… It was like talking to my team and I was like, “Oh my God, we got roughly a hundred notes. They’re all going to stop paying. They’ve lost their jobs. The economy shut down.” You know how many people stopped paying? One. One. Just one person out of a hundred. And we had an inventory of almost 49 or so parcels of land.
We were selling some of this stuff at three to five thousand dollars a lot. Some of it doubled because there was so much demand. We only had so much supply. And it just allowed us to charge more because our phones started blowing up roughly April timeframe. It’s created such a demand for land on the outskirts because, “We got to get out of the city at least for the weekend. We want to camp. We want to bring our RV. We don’t want to be close to anybody.” We’ve got people flocking out of New York and California just buying the stuff in the middle of nowhere because they’re going to build a cabin or a house or a getaway.

Chris Arnold:
Yeah, sure. I can’t tell you how many friends I have that have the same story, Brent. That, literally, buddies of mine from Dallas that have gone out and bought on the outskirts. Exactly what you’re talking about. Because I’m seeing this. I’m seeing this when my friends. They’re like, “I sold my house in Irving,” Or “I sold in Dallas.” I’m like, “Where are you going?” “Well, I bought two, five, ten acres in the outskirts.” So man, what an interesting time to not only do something that’s virtually no competition, but on top of that, to do something that’s so well-timed with what’s happening in the world. And that is, you’re having a shift of people migrating from the city into the country. That truly excites me more… Again, I don’t know a ton about land, right? That’s why I’m interviewing you. And I’m getting educated at the same time. And I’m looking at that and going, man, what a great time to really consider land with everything that’s going on. So I love it.
So I have another question cause I want to go back. Most people are buying recreationally, right? My question on top of that is, the average deal you’re doing, like size-wise, how much… We can say, okay, if you wholesale a deal, you’re going to make 10 to 15, let’s say 20,000. But we’ll give a range of… I’m going to give a very conservative range, low end 8,000 average to maybe 20,000 average, moving the outlier, people like in New York and Cali and stuff. Right? So I can say the average deal, you’re going to make eight to 20,000, depending on your geographic area. What’s the average that you’re producing off a land deal because your seller financing? It’s got to be bigger, right? If it’s all paid off and played out, the way that you set it up on terms, what’s your average deal size?

Brent Bowers:
So for a while there, it was quite small. The first couple of deals I did, I was just really nervous. I needed proof of concept. I was afraid to put the money into it. I was literally buying land for $285 and flipping it to realtors for 5,000. So I would spend 285 to make 5,000. And then I was like, “Okay, this is working. Let’s start spending some more money.” So I would say our average deal, we’re spending maybe $4,000 and selling it for about 16 to 17,000. So my minimum baseline is a 3X return. And like I said, I didn’t… I’m a simple guy. I didn’t plan this whole thing. I just, dumb luck, was doing land. And then we had this whole crazy market thing and all this demand, same thing. I got that from Warren Buffet. If he spends a dollar, he wants to make three back. So that’s our minimum threshold. I’m not saying we only make 3X return, or 300% ROI. I mean, we’ve done deals that was 2900% return on investment. So, my average-

Chris Arnold:
Some of the biggest deals I’ve done, Brent, have been land deals, by the way. It’s funny.

Brent Bowers:
So funny you say that.

Chris Arnold:
[crosstalk 00:31:11] was the in-filled city lots? Is that what you called it?

Brent Bowers:
Yeah. Build-able lots.

Chris Arnold:
Yeah. There are a few, again, those are easier to do because they’re in a geographical area that’s real close to where you live. But I can tell you some of the biggest deals I’ve ever done have been tear downs where we flip them over to a build or something. I’m talking like six figure land deals.

Brent Bowers:
That’s so [crosstalk 00:31:31].

Chris Arnold:
So I’ve had that experience. And again, I’m not a land guy. I don’t market. I don’t understand the way that… All that you’re doing it, which you’ve definitely just come in and put this thing on steroids. But I’ve done enough deals and tinkered with some land and know that you can get some big payouts on land because they’re awesome.
So I want to break this down, right? Number five, simplicity. Number four, geographical freedom. Number three, virtually no competition. Number two… And we added these together a little bit. Freedom of time and freedom financially. Now here’s what I love, and I want to close with this. The freedom financial is what I love about what you’re doing with land, based on what I understand, is you are getting off the transaction treadmill. Because one of the challenges with wholesaling is if you do it long-term, the problem is every month you start back at zero, you have to make more revenue than you do on your expenses. And if you have a profitable month, great. If you go below, then you lose money. But fundamentally, you’re only as good as your last deal. It’s a “transaction treadmill,” is what I call it. That’s fine to have that. But if you don’t have something that’s producing residual, you can’t get out of the game.
So why I like this financial freedom is you actually have an exit strategy where there’s going to be a point where you don’t have to keep doing deals, right? Because you’re receiving so much off of these notes that you’re setting up. Is that right?

Brent Bowers:
That’s exactly right. Every single month our income goes up. Let’s do a quick example. Say we sold five parcels of land this week. You know, we did five. And each one of those parcels of land gives a $200 a month payment. You know, really small. Most everyone can kind of wrap their heads. Most people can afford $200 a month. So that’s a thousand dollars that week increase, a thousand dollars. We just increased our passive income a thousand dollars a month in just one week.

Chris Arnold:
Because when you go to the next month, the same thousands is going to come back in. That’s the beauty of it.

Brent Bowers:
Exactly.

Chris Arnold:
That’s the beauty of residual income.

Brent Bowers:
Exactly. And some people… I want to go where some people’s minds are going right now. “Well, what about when that land pays off in five years?” Okay. I just talked about one week in a 52 week year. So let’s do 52 weeks times five. Imagine what your team, your business, your buying and selling machine, this business that is serving you has created five years from now, five years from now.
And then, Oh, by the way, here’s a nasty part about the land business. Here’s what’s gross about the land business. Every once in awhile, people will default. Easy come, easy go. No credit check, no background check. They’ll do their down payment. They’ll do their monthly payment. And sometimes, about… It’s less. We’ve gotten it down to like 7% now by educating our buyers and also getting a bigger down payment. But about 7% of our notes, our land buyers, will default and we’ll take the land back and we’ll resell it to somebody else. We’ll get another down payment, another monthly payment.
And here’s what’s was so crappy about it. Most of the time we’re already profitable in the land. So we’ve already made a profit on this land and we resell it, and these people lose out on their money. So we do things like, “Hey, if you get back on your feet, we’ve got more land to sell you,” type thing, and we’ll give them a credit. But that’s the ugly part about this business, that I’ve had some friends that are land investors, that they brag about this. We collaborate on it, and I do love meeting other land investors because I like to see what they’re doing. But I believe that my children’s children are going to end up with some of this land.

Chris Arnold:
Absolutely, man, I love it. I love it. Man, you know, sitting down and listening all your points, and kind of piece by piece, man, I can understand just this value of why looking and considering land. For some people listening today, they’re like, “Man, this is exactly what I was looking for.” And that’s what I always tell people. I don’t care for talking, Brent, about a marketing strategy or, let’s elevate to a higher level, even a real estate strategy, because there’s a lot of strategies that you can consider. It’s all about finding something that’s a good fit for you, that you love. If you’re doing a particular real estate strategy or marketing strategy and every day you hate to do it, I’m going to push back and be like, “Lay it down and go find something you love to do every day.” If you’re so exhausted doing text blasting, and it’s just eating your lunch and you hate it, and you hate the way it makes you feel, then go do something like Radio.
If you’re wholesaling deals and you’re like, man, I just don’t want to do this for the next 10 years. I’m listening. I’m thinking like the person that’s listening, and they’re like 50. And they’re on their second career. They went and worked the corporate. They finally got out. And so they don’t have another 20 years that they want to be doing this. They want to do this for another five to ten years. But they’re like, “I don’t understand how I’m going to stop.” You might be listening to this going, “Man, this is exactly what I was looking for.” So I really believe that you got to match the strategy to what’s your personal goals are and what gets you excited.
And, Brent, what I love about you, man, is I just know how passionate you are about this because it fits you perfectly, which is great. So, Brent, people are listening. How do they sign up? How do they do this course? If they’re like, “Dude, I’m all over this. I’m in. What do I got to do?” Where do they go?

Brent Bowers:
Yeah. To answer your question, if you’re thinking about this, wondering if this is a good fit for you, sign up. Go to wholesalinginc.com/land. That’s wholesaling, I-N-C dot com, forward slash, land. Fill out the form. Read all about it. Talk to someone on our team, and we’ll see if we’re a good fit. We’ll see if we can help you with what your goals are.
And I love that fact, that point you just made Chris, because I was on a two hour run this morning. I ran for two hours this morning and I was so mad because I had this YouTube channel I wanted to listen to and my phone died in the first mile. And I’m just like, “Ah.” But it allowed me to think for like the next 13 miles. And I was thinking to myself, “If someone handed me like $5 million right now, what would I be doing? What would I do? How would I change my life?” So it allowed me to kind of deep think. So it was a blessing from God my phone died.
And then I just thought to myself, it’s like, rather than run two hours, I might run four. That was it. I’m finally doing what I want to do and what I love doing. So I love that point you made. Steve Jobs says it, too. It’s like, if I look in the mirror more than like two or three days, and I don’t like what I’m doing, I change everything. So it’s just… I have so many wholesalers that come on board as students. And Joseph, a guy, just texting with him before this podcast said, “Hey, I wholesaled this house and the guy gave me the land for free. I’ve already found a buyer for $22,000.”

Chris Arnold:
Love it.

Brent Bowers:
So he added that to his wholesaling business-

Chris Arnold:
Added it, too.

Brent Bowers:
… Just like that.

Chris Arnold:
It’s another tool. It’s another tool in the belt. And maybe, if you’re listening, the combination is to do both. Here’s the great thing about real estate, man. You get to choose your own adventure. You get to choose what’s best for you. And I can tell you, working with Brent, just to take a sec to speak on behalf of him, we did Radio together. Again, I always love watching students come through. You can learn a lot about people watching them go through a coaching program. Dude came through, just blew right through it. Set it up. Just crushing it on Radio. And then as I’ve got to know him, I think the most important characteristic in a coach is character.
And so I can tell you, man, with Brent, if you decide to go that route, I do tell you this, you’ll be in really good hands with him because this is a guy that’s in it for the right reasons. And of course, his core values and his faith and all of that determine the fact that he’s going to make sure he takes good care of anyone that he’s entrusted with to coach. So definitely check him out. And see the rest of you guys, thank you so much for joining. Until next time, we will catch you soon when we add more value. Talk to you later.

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Wholesaling