Posted on: May 03, 2018

Frans Calderon Lopez is a thriving wholesaler who calls Charleston, South Carolina home. He started his real estate journey in 2009. Even while employed full-time, he looked forward to the day he can quit his job and achieve financial freedom.

The sanguine Colombia native is now doing wholesaling full-time and is closing one deal after another. When he started wholesaling, Frans admitted he didn’t know a thing about it. However, he’s now totally thriving and is well on his way to achieving his dream of financial independence.

If you think wholesaling is something you can’t do or something you might not succeed at, today’s episode might just convince you otherwise. Also, make sure you have a pen and paper handy. You’ll have plenty of insights, wisdom, and practical advice to take note of in today’s episode!

Key Takeaways

  • The marketing tool Frans used to score his first deal
  • How he financed some of his deals
  • What a hard money lender is
  • Quick ways to find investors in your area
  • The importance of collecting video testimonials
  • The service he used to build his website
  • What wholetailing is
  • The total number of offers he got after he followed Todd Toback’s advice
  • Why letting the market decide the price is ideal


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Episode Transcription

Tom Krol: Hey everybody. Welcome to another amazing episode of Wholesaling Inc. my favorite podcast, we’ve got an amazing guest today, a tribe member in Charleston, South Carolina, Franz Lopez who is absolutely crushing it and he is going to share details about how he is making a fortune, finding discounted properties and what he does with them.
If you don’t know who I am, my name is Tom Krol. I am the founder of Wholesaling Inc. the number one wholesaling coach in America and wholesaling. If you don’t know what that is, wholesaling is the art of making a fortune by consistently finding discounted properties. So it’s an exciting way, even if you don’t know anything about real estate and you don’t know where to get started, if you can find discounted properties and they are out there all around you, you can make a fortune. So let’s go ahead and get started. This young man is one of our tribe members. He’s a student of Wholesaling Inc. He’s out there crushing it. He is just yesterday closed a deal. We were going to ask him some questions where I think he made 40K or 30 well, how much? How much did you make Franz on that last one? The one you just did yesterday?

Franz: The last one was 35.

Tom Krol: 35 and then he’s projected to make a 40K one, but he called in with a question that we wanted to put them on the air with because he is wholetailing a deal, meaning that he found discounted property, he put it under contract. I’m going to let him tell you what he did and what his question is and who he has that thank for that because he has to thank one of our coaches for some of the success he had, which is great that I wasn’t involved with it. So I’m super excited about that. So we’re going to pick his brain. This is the no fluff, no BS zone. We’re going to get right to the meat and potatoes so he can tell us detailed information so that you can go out and do it right now. Progress, not perfection.
Let’s get started. All right Franz. So welcome to the sec. This is your second podcast, is that right?

Franz: Well we try one time but this is the first one-

Tom Krol: Oh this is the first one- [crosstalk 00:02:50] Yeah. I remember having… I know we’ve had a lot of support calls, but what happened on the first one then it just not get recorded cause I know I’m not good at always remembering to hit that-

Franz: Also, they were right there, that happened at the end. So I think for that reason they went.

Tom Krol: Oh, right, because I think you were getting ready to kind of do deals and then I kind of vaguely remember, but okay. Either way, this is your first one. So welcome to the show again or for the first time. So that’s awesome. So good, good, good. So you are a tribe member who is having a lot of success. So we want to interview you and we want to get right to the meat and potatoes. But before we do that, just very quickly, tell us a little bit about who you are, what you do, how you got to where you are, and you know what does all that look like? Who is Franz?

Franz: Okay, thank you Tom for a having me here. So, I started investing in real estate in 2009. That was my first house that I bought here, but I have a regular job. I would work in a company and I keep working and investing in real estate, always with my goal to achieve the financial freedom. So last year, I get to that point to the financial freedom. So I had the courage to quit my job and then I decided to join to the tribe, at the same time, because I knew that the tribe were the best place to be.

Tom Krol: Awesome. Well, I’m honored to hear that. That’s awesome. Now, but it sounds like you got started a little bit before joining us, so in 2009 it sounds like you had, what did you have a single transaction? How did you, what kind of transaction was it? How much money did you make or lose and how did you figure out how to do that? Because you know you must have had an either a mentor or a resource or a book. What, what did that look like?

Franz: Okay. In 2009, was because I went to the [inaudible 00:04:41] location, I did the training with them.

Tom Krol: Got it.

Franz: And they have a lot of three years and everything, but I stayed to try and try until I find a house. I didn’t know very much anything about real estate here in America, but then, I just say, okay, I’m going to do it. Find this deal actually I bought it very good. I bought it. The house was a single family home for 42,000. I rent it for four years. Then I went to live in that house for two years and then I sell it for 180,000.

Tom Krol: Awesome! So good! And you followed the rich dad poor dad model that you guys is Robert Kiyosaki. He’s a friend of mine, awesome individual. One of the original founders of real estate investing. I mean if there is a founder, if there is such a thing, he certainly a lighthouse for all of us in this industry. So, that is good to hear.
All right, so let’s get right to the meat and potatoes. I know you have a deal that you kind of had called in about and you had some questions about it. You use the term called wholetailing. So what does that crazy word? What does it mean? Let’s talk about that. But before we do, I do want to ask you, you just made a $35,000 deal and you’re about to make another one. Now those two deals, those were rehab deals, is that right?

Franz: Yeah, those two were rehab deals.

Tom Krol: Okay, got it, got it. Now let me ask you this question. You’re in Charleston, South Carolina. Were those two deals in Charleston, South Carolina?

Franz: Yes. Yes.

Tom Krol: Okay. So my first question is, number one, how did you find the sellers that were willing to pay or to sell at a discounted rate? And did you have the money like in your pocket, in your bank account? And I don’t mean to be facetious, but you know, a lot of new people when they start, it’s like how did you actually get the cash? How much was the house and how did you get the money, you know, to buy the property? Did you finance it through a bank and how did you get the money to rehab? And could you just really quickly kind of tell us a little bit more about like if somebody wants to get started, what did that look like?

Franz: Absolutely. Okay. The first deal came with the bandit signs. I was doing bandit signs and a Senator called me one day. They say that they want to sell the house. So I said, yes, absolutely. I am here to help. So she explained me that she has a house in a nice neighborhood, but she was renting the house and she had some problems with the tenent. So we met with Dane. She said, you know what, I am so tired of this house that I just want that if you can pay me the balance on my mortgage. I’m happy with that. And I checked the balance on the mortgage, that was a great deal on this property.

Tom Krol: I love it. So you guys, I want you everybody to just understand this. There’s two important things. There’s a few things that Franz just said that are really important. Number one is he found a deal through a bandit sign. What did the bandit signs say? I’m going to ask you in a second and how many did you put out and where did you put them so people can copy you and did that go to your phone mail or voicemail or to a phone number? You know, that was like your cell phone. And number two is I just want you guys to realize for every so many people who want to sell their property, most people, they either want price and convenience and they’re willing to sacrifice the speed of the sale or they want price and they want it sold fast. Meaning they want a high price and they want it sold fast and they’re willing to sacrifice convenience.
Our sellers exist. You are surrounded by motivated sellers. It’s the smallest part. It’s the minority of sellers fit this category, but the sellers we’re looking for, they want speed and convenience and they are willing to sacrifice on the price. That’s who we’re looking for. That’s what Franz did a great job of finding so awesome being scrappy, gritty, persistent, determined, making it happen. Super proud of your brother. That’s awesome.

Franz: Thank you.

Tom Krol: I love it. Now are you an expert rehabber? Like do you know how to rehab? Are you like trained or did you just kind of like, cause you made a lot of money on that deal. What did all of that look like and where did you get the money for the deal? Again, I don’t know if you went over that.

Franz: Yeah. Okay. Actually I always say that. Yeah, I have a good label two or three rehabs. I have done several other rehabs already and I have a good team of people right here to do any kind of work. So I ain’t good in that. For this one, I gave the funding with a hard money lender-

Tom Krol: Hard money lender.

Franz: [crosstalk 00:09:02] There are hard money lenders right here.

Tom Krol: Okay, so let me just stop you right there because a lot of people are there listening to this. They want to get involved in real estate. They have no idea where to start. Even if I find a good deal, how am I going to get the money to pay for it? I don’t have good credit. Right. Whatever it is. What is a hard money lender? Where did you find that? Him or her, what can somebody do? Was that from your title company? From going to a REIA meeting or real estate investors association meeting? What did that look like?

Franz: Yeah. Harmony Lender is pretty much a private investor that is willing to loan you money against, to the property, to the deal.

Tom Krol: Got it.

Franz: They don’t care about your credit, your background, anything. If the deal, they have equity and they are secure right there, they are going to be willing to launch you the money, to the deal.

Tom Krol: So let me, [crosstalk 00:09:50] let me say what you just said. I just want to summarize. What you’re saying is, just to recap, is that these people will lend you money on the deal, not on you. Is that accurate?

Franz: Absolutely correct.

Tom Krol: You guys? I hope everybody understands that if, if you can bring a hard money lender a good deal, they will lend the deal, they’ll lend you the money based on the deal, not on you. So even if your credit is no good and you don’t have any cash, that’s not what they’re lending on. So very, very important point. Go ahead.

Franz: Yeah, so I get the… [inaudible 00:10:17] Bessel recommend me this Harmony Lender was locally, I met. He already made a coupled more deals with me. So when I showed him this deal he say, okay Franz, I will do it for you. No problem. And then we closed very quickly in this house-

Tom Krol: [crosstalk 00:10:34] Okay, so just, just one more second Franz. I’m sorry cause I want to make sure everybody’s following. So Franz got this hard money lender, the person who’s going to lend him money on this deal from another investor. So a few quick ways you can find other investors in your market at your local REIA meeting. Number one. Number two, cold calling, craigslist, looking for people who are selling houses. Those people are usually investors. A lot of landlords, people on Craigslist who have a home for rent, especially when they have multiple listings and they’re not a property manager. Those people might also either be hard money lenders or certainly they will know a hard money lender. You can also check out your title company and ask for people who are willing to loan on deals. And Franz, I do have to ask you, what is the rate that you paid this hard money lender.

Franz: Okay. To this hard money lender, I need two points of origination points-

Tom Krol: Okay.

Franz: At ten percent interest rates.

Tom Krol: I love it. So guys, what that means is two and ten means that if Franz borrowed $100,000, the minute he borrowed the money, he had to pay two points, which is two percent which is $2,000 and then he had to pay annualized 10% meaning if he held the money for the full year, he would have had to pay $10,000. If he only pulled it, held the money for six months, it would have been 5,000. If he only held the money for three months, it would have been 2,500. That’s when it’s annualized, the interest rates, so, okay. Franz, go ahead. I’m sorry to keep interrupting you. I know you’re getting frustrated with me, but I want to make sure everyone’s-

Franz: [crosstalk 00:12:01] No, no, that’s good. That’s good that you keep asking your question. Okay, and I tell you in this deal actually, these were the underwrite close today. I want to share these with you because we did a very good job in the renovation and the seller is a young couple. They are going to get married this year and the, not seller, the buyer wrote me a letter that was the most beautiful testimony, you know? That I have from a buyer and you know, he fall in love with the house and his fiancee fall in love with the house, as well. And they was like, please let me buy this house. And today when I had the pleasure to meet them, with the closing, they were so happy. So things fall for me to be selling the house today and they already visualize the entire family living in the house, they really want to have kids and everything. So that was very proud to have delivered that good product to our customers.

Tom Krol: Did you get the testimonial on video?

Franz: No, I get it one later. Yeah-

Tom Krol: I would make a recommendation Franz, on every testimonial you get, especially from the sellers, but additionally from the buyers, you should start right now to get a testimonial, every single time. If you don’t have a testimonial app, then I would say use a just your cell phone. Just turn it horizontally and just have the title company or whoever you’re with hold it and just ask them about the service. Was it fast? Was it on time? Did they get all the money that they were supposed to? Did they get their check when they were supposed to, you know, all of the stuff. Did you follow through? Did you follow up? Did you under promise and over deliver? But I would start to make a habit of collecting testimonials. There is nothing like a video testimonial for companies. So I would certainly start to make a habit. But that’s awesome. So, so the second deal you actually closed, that’s the one that’s closing today or tomorrow rather or today-

Franz: The second deal, I closed the day before yesterday.

Tom Krol: That’s amazing.

Franz: [crosstalk 00:14:13] And in that one, so I found it from my website. I have a website and a lady give me a call from there-

Tom Krol: [crosstalk 00:14:24] Did you build your own website or did you use a service?

Franz: No, I used service, InvestorCarrot-

Tom Krol: InvestorCarrot guys. I use them myself. I love him. Great website. Let them know that you are either a tribe member or let them know that you are a fan of Wholesaling Inc. and they will give you a great deal and that’s awesome. Okay, so you had your carrot website and she just found you online?

Franz: Yes, I think she find me online. She called me to the number that I have in the website and she was very motivated to sell. At the beginning, what she was asking, was not a good deal. So in that moment I say it’s not a good deal or maybe I’m going to pass on that one, but I was training my acquisition manager. So I said, you know what, I’m going to go to this appointment because I can train my acquisition manager, even if we don’t close with a deal. [crosstalk 00:15:17] But I already have in mind what was my battle line, my maximum allowable offer. I say, this is my number. If I can get this one, I going to get the [inaudible 00:15:27] lift note and just let it go.

Tom Krol: So, you go to the house with a number in mind of how much you’re the top number that you’re willing to pay for that property.

Franz: Correct.

Tom Krol: Love it.

Franz: So we went there with that cause she’s a manager. The spectrum of the house with the numbers, everything that we need to do for their renovation. And the seller actually she told me she was experienced at selling cars. So I start explain her, what is our reasoning that we went to buy her house to fix it, to sell it. And when we start to explain how much money, we had to put into the house and where we need to be to make a profit because this is our full time job. She agreed with the price. I gave her my offer and explain her the numbers and share with her the price. Right. Right there. She say okay, how are we doing with you with that price?

Tom Krol: Wow. I love it. Okay, beautiful. So you get the deal now is this the deal? Okay, very, very cool bro. You’re killing it right now. This is awesome. I mean you are in the point in your business where you’re just ready to explode. And that’s why before this podcast started, guys, I was talking, I was talking to Franz about Rhino Roundtable, which is kind of our next level coaching program. It’s for the people who are now there. They, you know, they’ve done over $100,000 in profit and now they’re ready to take it to the next level. So I definitely Franz want to talk to you about that. But let me ask you this question. What is the deal that you were talking about when you first called in. You had a question about a wholetailing a deal. What did that look like?

Franz: Okay, this deal is one that I’m going to be closing this week. And that was that I went to vacation and before went to vacation, I put the property under contract and actually I closing the property because that was a sobering deal. I-

Tom Krol: [crosstalk 00:17:22] Okay so, you mean you already bought the-

Franz: Yes. I closing in the property.

Tom Krol: Okay, got it.

Franz: And they will start to…we put in the market to all our cash buyers. So we have a lender, they insure many, many cash buyers. We know they’re there, but the house has a foundation problem that actually is covered under the warranty. So, we’re good right there. But most of the investors they weren’t… can’t always carry. So we, many of patient [crosstalk 00:17:51] people who wants to get the… wants to buy the house but in the end, we didn’t get any offer right there. And I was in here [inaudible 00:17:58] and I was on vacation.

Tom Krol: Got it.

Franz: I’d be much good. My acquisition managers was talking with the cash buyers. So in those days we went to the Wholesaling Team Summit, on Orlando.

Tom Krol: Yes, I remember. Okay.

Franz: Yeah. So I remember I was ready. The acquisition manager call me, say Franz, I have been showing 100 times to the cash buyers, but we haven’t get an offer. Actually in that time, I haven’t buy the house it was still under contract only.

Tom Krol: Got it.

Franz: So, and you know when I get that, I say, you know, what… I think it’s going to be time to, to let it go because we didn’t get any cash buyer to buy this house, any investor. I’m going to let it go.

Tom Krol: Got it.

Franz: That was pretty much my decision. Then in the first night, the networking night, I met your brother.

Tom Krol: Got it.

Franz: I thought, go back. [crosstalk 00:18:5] That was great because that was a good time. I was talking to him and I asked him, “Hey Todd, why is your main story here right now?” And he’d say, “Wholesaling.” And I say, “tell me this, tell me more about it.” He said, “Yea friend, I just buy the house. I close in the house and this day I put it in the market.” I was like, “What?” He said, “yes, I don’t do anything. I didn’t do renovation, I didn’t do anything. I just buy it and then putting the in the MLS.” I say, “Wha Ha-”

Tom Krol: Yeah, let’s stop for one second and take a deep breath because I want everybody to hear this. So you always have to keep in mind, wholesaling is the art of finding a discounted property. So what Todd gave advice to Franz on was take the property down, purchase the property, and simply put the deal on MLS. That is where you’re going to have the most buyers. And this is a very simple game of supply and demand. So when you have a ton of cash buyers on MLS, you can put the property on MLS and, and resell it that way. That is your best bet. So I love it. So I guess you must have done that. And then what happened?

Franz: Yeah, so we’ve been in the conversation say I took the position and I said, “you know what? I not gonna to let this houses go. I gonna close on the property and I’m going to put in the market [crosstalk 00:20:1] and location and everything-

Tom Krol: [crosstalk 00:20:16] I love it. And just so everybody knows Todd Toback, he’s one of our coaches. He actually coaches, he’s my stepbrother. He actually coaches Rhino Roundtable or our higher level coaching program. So he gave Franz advice while we were in Orlando, our last summit, our Wholesaling Inc. summit was in Orlando. It was an amazing time. Just incredible.
Our next one, I do want to let you guys know it will, by the time this podcast is released, it will be available to book. It’s going to be in Asheville, North Carolina; Asheville, North Carolina, October, 15, 16, 17. I know the marketing guys and the editors, they always hate when I date these podcasts, but if you are thinking about going, do not wait to book because it absolutely fills up. We were busting at the seams. We actually had a little hiccup because we had too many people at our last one. So at this time we’re actually going to have, well, I will… there’ll be a surprise when you get there. It’s going to be awesome. So Franz, hopefully we’ll see you there in October. [crosstalk 00:21:12] Peak of color season in Asheville, North Carolina in the fall. We’re going to have a blast.
All right, so you put the property in the market and what happens?

Franz: Oh, that’s the best part.

Tom Krol: Oh I love it. What do you got brother?

Franz: Actually [inaudible 00:21:29] they put it in the market and we were receiving calls every single minute. [crosstalk 00:21:36].

Tom Krol: I love it. Every single minute!

Franz: We have a line of people waiting to see the house. [crosstalk 00:21:39] Everybody went to see the house.

Tom Krol: I love it.

Franz: And then we received 13 offers.

Tom Krol: How many?

Franz: 13.

Tom Krol: All right. You ready? You guys? 13 offers. Here we go. Here we go. We’re going to count ready. [Bell ringing 00:21:53]
I love it brother. I love it, 13 offers. I can’t even imagine. Awesome. All right, so that is phenomenal. How much money did you make on the deal or what… you are about to, right because-

Franz: [crosstalk 00:22:13] Yeah, but before that I want to mull our other golden nugget or golden egg. [crosstalk 00:22:18] So something that I learned in the summit, or from Toback was that he say that he used to put the houses a little below the price, below of what he’s expecting to get. And I say, “why Todd?” He explain me. He says, “Franz, because you put it below, you’re going to get more attention and as you get more than attentions, their offers are gonna just go up and up and up.

Tom Krol: [crosstalk 00:22:49] I totally agree. This is, you know, Todd teaches a program called bigger deals. Now Franz, are you in bigger deals?

Franz: Yes.

Tom Krol: Okay, so Todd is a coach and another program called Bigger Deals and if you guys want to find out more about it, it’s called and Franz is in that program. All that one does is say, Hey listen, don’t do more deals, just make your deals tremendous and Todd is specializing in that. So if you’re interested in that, definitely check that out, but here is the deal that makes all the difference. When you put that property below, it’s super, super uncomfortable. As a matter of fact, I just got back from collective genius and we had two of the members there who are very successful in Los Angeles and they are rehabbers and they do the same thing.
They want to sell quick and at a high price so they put the market below. All real estate agents, what they try to do is they try to price the property just right and wait for an offer. Don’t do that. Follow that program, put it super low and then wait for the offers come in, let the market determine the price. So that is a gold nugget that is dipped in gold and then covered in gold a second time and then covered in diamonds because that will make a humongous difference and create a feeding frenzy around your deals, whether you’re an agent, wholesaler, wholetailer, rehabber, or a landlord, it doesn’t matter. Price it low, attract attention. You want to fill that, that crab trap with a lot of chicken and fish, right? And you get a lot of crabs, which is awesome. So, that’s the way to do it. I couldn’t agree more.

Franz: So we get that and actually doing these method, this is strategy, we get $30,000 over the asking price.

Tom Krol: $30,000 over the asking price. I love it. So what is the total profit going to be on that deal?

Franz: In this profit, the proof is going to be about $34,000.

Tom Krol: $34,000. So let me just get this right. So you had just, so this is going to be your third year, so one that was like yesterday. Then one closing today and then this one. When is that one going to close?

Franz: It’s on April 9th.

Tom Krol: So just on those three deals, what is the profit margin on that?

Franz: It’s going to be over 100.

Tom Krol: Is there any other way in the entire United States and you’re not, it sounds like you said something before. It sounds like you’re not even from… where were you born Franz?

Franz: Hey, I am from Columbia, South America.

Tom Krol: I love it. You are an inspiration. Is there any other better way in the world? Forget America in the world to make a tremendous fortune in a short amount of time. Is there anything else that you could think of besides this?

Franz: No, this is for the reason I quit my job and I am 100% here.

Tom Krol: What were you doing before? What was your job?

Franz: I was working at Boeing in manufacturing, building the 787.

Tom Krol: Wow. Well that’s, I was… I didn’t expect you to say that. That’s awesome. Okay, that’s awesome. I was thinking you were going to say you had a sales job or something. So you are super smart, but that’s awesome. So you guys, I want you to know if I can do it, you can do it. If Franz can do it, you can do it. Wholesaling Inc., wholesaling houses, this is where it’s at. Finding people who are willing to sell at a discount. I don’t care what your exit strategy is, you can find those deals. You should be able to make a fortune in a very, very short amount of time.
I love it. It’s changed my whole life and it sounds like it’s changing Franz. Franz, I’m honored to be on this journey with you brother. It’s really, it’s a great adventure and I’m going to call you very soon here and I am, I want you to join us at Rhino Roundtable. They’re actually, as we record, they’re all in San Diego, right now. You know, making toasts at the top floor of some big fancy building. So I’m not there with them, but they’re, there were Todd and Cody and a few other people. So yeah, I will see you at the next one. That’s awesome man. Congratulations.

Franz: [crosstalk 00:26:30] Thank you.

Tom Krol: I think you’ve got a great heart. You’ve got a great energy. I loved interviewing you here. This podcast is going to help a lot of people and I’m looking forward to it, so thank you very much for your time, man. I appreciate that.

Franz: Thank you. My pleasure to be here. Thank you for having me here. And I always say thank you for the introduction program or everything that I have learned here in the tribe.

Tom Krol: You got a brother. Hey, let me ask you one last question before I let you go. A book that has changed your life. A book, I mean, leaders are readers, our tribe or all of our listeners. We are big readers, not just audio books, but actually picking up a paper book and reading it. What is one that you’ve read recently or one that you’ve read in the past that’s changed your life, influenced you the most? Any book that you can make a recommendation for us to read.

Franz: Okay. Have the perfect for one, for everybody right here.

Tom Krol: Let’s hear it.

Franz: The E Myth.

Tom Krol: Oh, Michael Gerber, the E. Myth.

Franz: Michael Gerber.

Tom Krol: Yes. I love that book. Oh man, that’s great.

Franz: I read the book that’s helping me a lot because right now I am building our organization. We are building a team right here. We are getting this strong here and then I structure our organization and it’s thanks to that book. I listen like three times to that book and I say, you know what? I need to stop on my own readings and to study and implement that book. And it is what I am doing right now. Implementing that book, in my business.

Tom Krol: Franz, you’re going to do great things. That is a great resource. Thank you for sharing it. I highly recommend the E myth by Michael Gerber. I totally agree with you. That book really touched my heart when I was younger. I had a family member, an uncle who is now since passed away, who was a great mentor and leader in my life and he recommended that book to me and I’m so grateful he did.
It’s a game changer, so thank you for that. You’re a great man and I’m honored to be on this journey with you. I really am. It’s going to be… I can’t wait to see what you do in the next 90 days and I’m looking forward to seeing you at Roundtable. I’m absolutely… this is a sales call so I’m going to convince you to join Roundtable, so that’s good. Well, God bless you, man, and thank you for your time.

Franz: All right. Thank you so much.

Tom Krol: All right Franz. God bless. Enjoy your [crosstalk 00:28:42] closing today.

Franz: You too. [crosstalk 00:28:43]

Tom Krol: We will talk to you soon. All right. [crosstalk 00:28:45]

Franz: Bye bye.

Tom Krol: Bye bye.

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