In today’s special episode, Cody and Brent dissected the first quarter of 2018—the figures, the marketing channels they’ve used, and their advice to people who would like to duplicate their success.
If you want to escape the 9 to 5 rat race and enjoy financial freedom, consider today’s show a must-listen. So many valuable information, superb wisdom, and actionable tips packed in this half an hour podcast; it just might provide the inspiration you need to give wholesaling a try!
- The top 2 marketing channels they swear by
- Their first quarter goals and results
- The marketing channels they credit their first quarter success to
- The benefits of cold calling
- What probate is
- The life skill that never goes away
- The marketing channel that costs significantly lower but provides great ROI
- The cost-effective lists you should take note of
- The importance of knowing people’s different personalities when doing marketing
- The marketing channels that have given them the best assignment average
- Why surrounding yourself with the right people is crucial
- Their advice to people who are starting out
If you are Ready to Explode Your Wholesaling Business, Click here to Book a Free Strategy Session with me right now!
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Brent Daniels: Hello Rhino Nation. This is Brent Daniels, and joining me today, a little bit of flip-flop, is Cody Hofhine. And we are just going to break down, and we think that it’s really, really important at the beginning of the year. 2018 has been absolutely outstanding so far. I mean, just on fire. Record-breaking first quarter so far.
So we just wanted to get together and just kind of ask each other questions, go over each other’s businesses. We’ve got very, very similar businesses and we’re both taking advantage of the top two marketing channels that we use right now, which is TTP, Talk to People, that’s doing the cold calling program and direct mail.
So we will touch on both of those, and give as much information as possible so that we can provide as much value as possible. But before I get started, before Cody just starts spitting flames at everybody on great ideas and great results, let me read this to you, because I really think that this is a great way to start this conversation. This is from the book, The Slight Edge, okay? This is page 119.
Cody Hofhine: Jeff Olson?
Brent Daniels: Yep. It’s called the ripple effect. When you create positive improvements in your life, you create positive ripples that spread out all around you, like a pebble of positivity dropped in a pond. Those ripples may not all be visible. In fact, they may be mostly invisible, but just because you or others may not see them doesn’t mean they’re not there. They are, and their impact can be enormous.
When you reach out and you positively affect one other person through your interactions and words, you create a slight change in that person, who is then more likely to reach out and positively affect someone else.
Simply put, one touches another, who touches another, who touches another through your everyday, I’m almost done, through your everyday attention to those simple positive actions, your happy habits and daily principles. You don’t only have an impact on yourself. You’re also having a powerful impact on everyone around you. Woo.
Cody Hofhine: That’s good stuff, but hold on. How do you like this school teacher bell?
Brent Daniels: I love it. It’s like you’re a deaf 80 year old guy sitting in his old library with a crackling fire.
Cody Hofhine: Oh, I love it. Well, let’s get going. Let’s start going to this. Here’s the thing. I love the sign behind Jeff, first and foremost, over by that door. You’ve got, “The more people I talk to, the luckier I am.” We were just talking about some of our favorite quotes. This was one by Arnold Palmer. It says, “It’s a funny thing. The more I practice, the luckier I get.”
Guys, it’s all about action, and I will promise you that we are going to deliver nothing but gold nuggets and take action on. What Brent and I are going to talk about will be of zero value if the action is not taken. You might feel good, you might feel like, “Oh, this is awesome,” but it’s not the feel-good that creates income, that creates deals. It’s the action that creates deals.
So definitely get a pen and paper ready because I know, Brent, you’re going to spit some fire more than I am, but we’ll just start rocking and rolling. Let’s keep going.
Brent Daniels: I don’t know about that. So here’s the thing. I think that it’s really, really important. I know with my TTP students, what we do is we break down all of our goals based on 90 day increments, okay? What is your 90 day goal? What is the first quarter goal?
So when we started out, different students start at different times in the program, but when we start out, that could be their first day and then the 90 days is their first quarter. So in the first quarter, the goal for my business was 405,000, and I’m happy to say that closing this month we’ll be at 416,000 for the first 90 days of 2018, and it has just been unbelievable. Amazing phone prospectors that are calling people every single day and just having those conversations that we wouldn’t normally have. It’s been incredible.
Cody Hofhine: Maybe break that down, Brent. What does that look like? So you want 405,000, you’re going to cap that, it looks like, by 10 or 11,000, which is huge. Let’s break it down for them, let’s help them out. What are those marketing channels? Where are you finding your success for 2018?
Brent Daniels: So, 160,000 of that is from direct mail, okay? So just the Wholesaling Inc program, exactly what you and Tom teach every single day to the T, letting it out there and really making some great deals, some really great deals, just from those little postcards, man. It’s crazy.
And that’s in Phoenix. Now, in Phoenix it’s hyper competitive. Listen, it’s hyper competitive everywhere, right? So, I mean, I can’t say that it’s extra competitive in Phoenix, but it takes a lot of mail to get those results.
So, my budget is significant for that. We send out about 60,000 mailers a month, and some of those take time to go through the pipeline and really get close. What I’m really happy about is 256 of that is from the TTP, from picking up the phones and calling people, and seeing if they would consider an offer on their property.
Cody Hofhine: Good gravy, man. I’m looking at those numbers. Those are phenomenal. So likewise, kind of share numbers maybe just a second. And you’ll see that this is very similar. This is pretty unique. This is very similar to what you’re doing. It’s very similar.
Our numbers are 450 for the first quarter, for first 90 days, and we are at 385 with the rest of this month to go, so we still have to hit our numbers and we are determined to get it. And again, this comes from what you said, direct mail and TTP.
Now, more importantly, Brent, I think that’s a huge shout-out to you is direct mail has always been our bread and butter. That was what it was, and it’s always been that. You only know what you know, right? And then Mr Brent Daniels comes along with that flowing hair and tells me, I’ve got to start cold calling.
And so, we started to implement this, and this was right after you spoke in Salt Lake. We already started working with you a little bit on this, and now we’re feeling the secret sauce, right? We were getting onesie-twosies right out of the gate when we started implementing this cold call approach, but January was now six, seven months, almost eight months of cold calling going.
And that’s when the magic… You really starting to feel the magic of TTP, and we always loved it out of the gate, but we didn’t know when you said, “Oh, Cody, when it hits six months, all of a sudden you just feel some momentum behind you. You feel really a lot of the traction taking place.”
And January, for example, we were $80,000 alone from six deals. That was TTP. Now, more importantly on that is, call me crazy, it is very low traffic in the sense of that hyper competition that you can feel. Very little people go on these appointments, and it’s unique.
Now, it’s a collaboration of both the direct mail and the TTP, but these two channels are absolutely… Like you said, we haven’t had a first quarter like this. And I’ve been doing it since May of 2015, and I’m coming up on year three and I’ve never had a quarter that’s worked so smooth, and it’s been, really, just a joint partnership between just cold calling and direct mail. It’s been awesome.
Brent Daniels: Yeah, yeah. It’s really interesting. There’s so many different marketing channels, right? Some people are awesome at door knocking, some people are great at the bandit signs, some people are great with pay-per-click, and I get it. I mean, all of those can be effective.
I have found that to be able to really leverage the business, mail has been outstanding, right? Mail has been just fantastic, and I know that there’s a lot of people bagging on direct mail and I get it. It costs a lot to really get rolling and really make some traction in some of the bigger markets, I get it.
And that’s why TTP combines with it so easily because you are literally one phone call away from 10 grand, 20 grand, 50 grand, a hundred grand, whatever it is, whatever your exit strategy is, if you’re flipping it, if you’re holding it, you’ll not have to wait.
You could literally get those phone numbers, get the addresses, get the phone numbers, and have those conversations with the sellers right away, which is huge, you know what I mean? You don’t have to put together real elaborate systems to be able to do that. You just have to be able to have the courage to pick up the phone and talk to strangers, right?
And then in the TTP program, we’ve really created the system just to show you exactly what I do in my business and what the best students around the country are doing to be really successful, and how to scale that.
But if you’re just somebody that’s starting out and you haven’t done many deals and your budget’s not huge, I mean, I get it. That’s how I started out. I mean, I had nothing. I had no budget to be able to mail, let alone do something like a pay-per-click or anything like that. Some of these more cost-intensive marketing or the neighborhoods that I know that were most likely to be where the cash buyers were looking.
And once we started rolling with that, it really starts rolling. And especially if you’ve already got a mailing campaign going and you want to supplement it, you’re already making that you’re in that zone, right? And you’ve got a good budget, you could keep it rolling for minimal costs to get…
I mean, you know as well as I do that the costs for TTP is significantly lower. I mean, I’m talking… For me, who’s doing mega, mega, mega, mega amount of calls, my TTP is one third of the cost of my direct mail costs. But they’re both effective and both profitable.
Cody Hofhine: They are, they both have an ROI. That’s why the combination of both has been successful. I think there are so many people wondering, “What is 2018 going to bring? What is it? What are the marketing channels?” Is it to say that PPC is not it? Is it to say that just Facebook’s not it? I don’t know, but these two have been my favorite.
And here’s one thing that, maybe I just get it because I talk with you so often, that maybe people don’t realize the side benefit of just cold calling. And that is the fact that our cold callers that are here, that are 15 bucks an hour doing this, they now, in the three to six months they’ve been doing it… Who they were at the beginning and who they are now is so different. We have people come back that are cold callers saying, “We’re just on lunch appointment,” and I was sitting there, overheard someone talking about… They’re trying to get rid of this home that they inherited.
And so, I went over and started talking to them. Six months ago, this cold caller would not have done that. It’s making them so much more of a extrovert. They’re no longer holding onto that introvert or just the voice behind a phone. They’re busting out of their shells. They’re becoming more, they’re becoming better and they’re…
This is one thing that I’m telling you about of the unique benefits of TTP. It’s not just cold calling. They’re learning how to communicate with people, connect with people, and these skills are universal. It’s not just for wholesaling. You can use this for anything, and I’m noticing just from the six month cycle of people that have been with us doing it, how incredible even they are turned into… They’re now turned into a team player, and they’re really talking to everyone outside of just the phone, four or five hours a day that they’re doing.
Brent Daniels: Oh, it’s huge. Just to let you know, Cody, and everybody listening, I don’t think I ordered my own food until eighth grade. I was so frightened to talk to… I’m serious. I’m almost certain it was eighth grade. You know what I mean?
The first time I had to pick up the phone to do cold calling, it took me an hour and a half. An hour and a half of some serious affirmations, some pump up music, some affirmation, some pounding my chest, some, “You can do this,” type of thing. You know what I mean? And now, after you talk to a thousand strangers, or you talk to a hundred strangers, or whatever it is, and you’re having conversations about their house, you can have a conversation with anybody about anything.
Listen, it’s not just about being proficient at getting deals on the phone. This is a life skill that never goes away. After you talk to a lot of people and get into that uncomfortable zone, just like you were saying with your staff, that they started out and they’re kind of a little bit… Their baby giraffe legs kind of wobbling around and they’re trying to tiptoe and they’ve got that 500 pound phone. Once they get into that rhythm, they get poked to do it. It’s a shot of…
I mean, so much emotion and so much dopamine runs through your body when you have a good conversation that you almost want that. And when you link that, when you link the ability to pick up the phone and call somebody out of the blue with being able to provide extremely well for your family, to be able to build lifetime wealth by buying assets and by providing value, it’s crazy. It just comes out of the ether. It just floats out of nowhere and you’re like, “Oh my gosh. How does this even work? All I have to do is pick up the phone and see if people would consider an offer on their property.”
And that’s what we teach, and I think that that’s what’s really important. I think what’s really important, just like that says, “The more people I talk to, the luckier I am.” I don’t care how you do it, I’m just saying that the easiest way, the quickest way, is to pick up the phone and be proactive. That’s-
Cody Hofhine: Absolutely. Well, and there’s such a cost advantage. I hear so many people that are looking for, how do they get involved, how do they get into doing it? And I know there’s going to be so many people actually listening to this podcast and they’re thinking, “How do you get started? Where do you start?” What would you suggest to them? And let’s say someone is on a complete go in scale in general.
So whether it’s someone that has no money, or someone that has some funds available, what would you suggest to these individuals? Because I know there’s so many people, Brent, that really… They look at this and they see the polished version, Brent, and they think, “Oh man, there’s no way I could talk like Brent. Brent’s got a gift of gab. He’s got a golden tongue.”
I will tell you, it’s not always been that way, but where do you start? Where do you have them start so that they have hope? How do they break the nine-to-five? How do they get out of corporate America? How can they be Brent Daniels?
Brent Daniels: … Mm-hmm (affirmative). The quickest way, if you’re starting at absolutely zero, is to drive for dollars. Get all the addresses, the worst houses in your neighborhood, in your area. Write them down, get the owner’s information area and just get their phone numbers, skiptrace them through a reliable service, either LexisNexis or TLO, and get reliable numbers.
If you have to do white pages, try it out. If you have to try, whatever, reverse lookup, try it out, just reach out to people. And that’s how I would start. I would just start making calls and leaving messages and then from there, as you start going, if you do have a team, if you do have a budget, I highly…
If you’re going to take TTP seriously, cold calling seriously in your business as a major marketing channel, you have to call us. You have to get on one of our coaching calls and join the program because it’s a no-brainer. For the price versus the cost, it’s huge. The price is nothing compared to the cost of what it would be if you don’t join. I’m telling you, it’s just not even close.
Cody Hofhine: So the distress list is what you’re talking about. So driving for dollars, if they were to just drive around on the weekend, which by the way was one of my favorites. I told you one of those six deals in… No, this was December. We had a good deal and it ended up paying us $38,000. It was a driving for dollars.
This cold caller who said, “Hey, what incentivize you more instead of just hourly pay, on the weekends, if you’ll drive around and look for beat-up homes and bring us back those addresses, we’ll get the phone numbers for those and you call on them,” and heck of a deal came from that. And I love that drive for dollars. What are the lists that are cost-effective-
Brent Daniels: Top list.
Cody Hofhine: … besides… Yeah, besides driving for dollars? I mean, is there another list, maybe one other list? So we don’t give them too much, where it’s like, “Hey these are good two places to start.”
Brent Daniels: Probate.
Cody Hofhine: Probate?
Brent Daniels: Probate, yep.
Cody Hofhine: So, explain to someone that is new to this. What is probate?
Brent Daniels: Okay. So when somebody passes away and they don’t have their… It’s when the courts get involved to make sure that when their assets are dispersed, I guess, or given to the right people in the family. So when that happens, it triggers an actual-
Cody Hofhine: Court order?
Brent Daniels: Court order, sure. And that gets reported, and that’s when you can find out who’s going to be inheriting the property, and reach out to them and see if they would consider an offer.
Cody Hofhine: Such a good list, and I was hoping you were going to say that list. It’s been one of my favorite lists. So driving for dollars because it’s so cheap. You just drive around and find distressed properties, get the address. I love that. And then probate, the ones that someone’s passed away and now their inheritors are now inheriting the home. And usually it’s an executor of the trust.
Brent Daniels: We are not attorneys. We don’t know the verbiage here.
Cody Hofhine: This is not-
Brent Daniels: I just talk to people. They just give me a list and we just call them.
Cody Hofhine: … Correct. Just look for probate, and if you want a good definition, don’t take Brent’s or Cody’s-
Brent Daniels: Google it.
Cody Hofhine: … and just take action and call them. So those two lists are gold, they are gold. So that is something that regardless, now couple it with direct mail, and now you’re getting two different messages out there, because there’s some people that… Here’s what I’ve come to find out, and I hope this is a value to each of you listening is, I have found out that there’s so many different personalities.
Now, here’s one. You have a student, his name’s Dane, and he had a $70,000 deal here in Salt Lake City. And so, when I heard about this, he did a cold call, got this $70,000 deal. When I heard about it, I said, “Dane, what’s the name of this person address?” And I did some research within my own data, and there was no less than four times, four times that this guy has received mail from my company and never responded. Zero phone calls from this guy, but he’s been on our mail list four different times and never responded.
And so, there’s so many different personalities. Some people want to talk to a voice and they need someone to be proactive for them, because I don’t know if you find this a lot, even on wherever the lead comes from, it’s really hard for them to get things moving, to make the decision to keep moving forward. It’s hard, and so we’ve got to be there to help them. And cold calling takes that activity out of their hand, where you can approach them, because again, he didn’t call me and he’s received four of our mail pieces.
But then you’ve got other people that don’t really like talking to people. They like the soft approach of just, “Oh, I can call on this and see what it’s about,” or, “I can look up their website,” and then they see some testimonials in there. But all of this starts to add that value and credibility, so I love both of those combined. They’ve just been awesome.
Brent Daniels: It’s funny you mentioned that. Literally in February, we closed the deal for $50,000, five zero, right? Went to the appointment, and in his living room is a mound of mail. This is probably, I would say, minimum 18 months of mail piled up, minimum. And in that pile was three handwritten postcards that I had sent him, okay?
This was not a mail lead. This was a cold call lead. This guy literally just would not take any action at all, ever. Just his personality. When he got around to it, he got around to it, but we picked up the phone and called him. He was a guy that always answered his phone, always. Always answered his phone. Every time we called him, he’d answer his phone, he was just that type of guy. And it happens time and time and time again.
Another deal that we did, it was a driving for dollars that I did when I first started out, okay? This is 2014 when I was driving around, writing down the addresses myself and getting the numbers. I had given her brother an offer four years ago, okay? And somehow she had it and she sent it back to me four years ago, said that he had passed away and she’s ready to sell it now.
And she didn’t talk to anybody else because she had already had this offer for me and she just wanted to just sell it and get rid of it, and she didn’t want to mess with anybody else or talk to anybody else. And she knows that we would just take care of it. Four years ago. I mean, it’s bananas.
Cody Hofhine: Okay, so maybe in closing, some gold nuggets. When things are up and running, you got things going smooth with TTP, with direct mail, you’ve got a team in place that really feels comfortable with what they’re doing. What is an average assignment that you’re seeing in your market for you? What is your team?
Brent Daniels: 22,000.
Cody Hofhine: 22,000. So everyone listening, what that means is, every contract he gets, every home he puts under contract, it is worth $22,000. That’s what’s impressive, that’s what’s amazing. The collaboration of both these market channels are still netting some amazing average assignments that…
Our number, by the way, is just shy, so this month, it’s $22,750, but over the whole year, it’s $20,155, so we’re just below where you’re at and it’s unbelievable. Starting, it was not that way. It started $7,000 assignments, $10,000 assignments, $12,000-
Brent Daniels: 3-
Cody Hofhine: … $3,000 assignments, and the ones that were 3, I worked way too hard for it, by the way. But these ones, it seems to get better and better, and these two market channels, I guess, have been… I guess what I wanted to make sure that everyone listening to this, it’s been these two marketing channels that have net us the best assignment average and I can’t even believe it. Here we are into March and our average assignment is a little over $20,000, and it’s absolutely crazy.
Brent Daniels: Well, and I think it’s a huge testament. I mean, Wholesaling Inc is the biggest real estate wholesaling company, coaching company, in the world, probably. At least the country, for sure. And there’s two, right? There’s two main marketing channels that has taught in both program, in the Wholesaling Inc coaching program and the TTP program.
And there’s a reason for that. It’s because it works. Number one, the only reason we are in business is to bring value. The only reason we’re coaching, the only reason we’re teaching these programs is to bring value. The only way that it grows is if people are being successful, and people are being successful every single day with these two approaches.
It’s not just Cody and I, and Tom, and some of these other superstars that are in the group. It is people starting out brand new that are doing their first deals. It’s people that are starting to get out of their full-time jobs and have this…
At first, they’re highly paid professionals, right, when they’re doing their own deals, and then they create a business and be entrepreneurs, and it’s so incredible. The only reason that the coaching has grown this much, a testament to you, and to Tom, and to-
Cody Hofhine: And to-
Brent Daniels: … people-
Cody Hofhine: … you, by the way, brother, yes.
Brent Daniels: … Well, it is because it works. It works because, just like Tom says, “It’s the no fluff,” right?
Cody Hofhine: “No fluff, no BS zone.”
Brent Daniels: That’s it. I mean, that’s what it is, and it works, and it’s proven time and time again, you can look up the testimonials on the website and see people around the country doing it. So I’m very, very, very proud of the students that I have and extremely proud to be involved with you and Tom under the Wholesaling Inc umbrella, for sure.
Cody Hofhine: Well, Brent, you’ve been an asset, my friend. It’s been you that’s helped add value there. There is just that marketing channel. I’m telling you, these numbers wouldn’t be these numbers this year without adding your system. I’m being completely honest to everyone listening, my numbers would not be this way if it wasn’t the collaboration of both systems.
This is why our first quarter is going to be our best quarter we’ve ever had in a first quarter. We’ve never had a first quarter like this. We end the fourth quarter with a little over 450,000 and we did that after leaving Arizona. We wanted to kind of implement what you were doing and that was, if they hit the goal, take them on a trip, and they all hit the goal and we’re taking them on a trip.
Okay, brother, words of advice. Any things, if you were to start. I’ll do one and you do one. You go first. If you were to start all over again, what would you say is a word of advice for those just beginning in this journey? If you could start over, knowing what you know now, what would you do?
Brent Daniels: Literally, you are one call, one conversation away from making more money than you’ve ever made in a month with one call. Maybe it’s even a year with just one call. Just consistently get on and talk to people. That’s it. Very simple.
Cody Hofhine: I agree, I agree. If I’m going to throw one out there, it’s going to be speed of implementation. Surround yourself with people that are successful. If you want to be successful, surround yourself with the best. Surround yourself with those that are successful and implement what they say.
If they tell you, “I do this,” go do that. That’s exactly what you need to be doing. You are the average of the five closest individuals you hang out with. Make sure you surround yourself with the right people, and when they say something, go do it. Take action.
Brent Daniels: Love it. Come see me if you guys are interested in the TTP program, www.wholesalinginc/ttp. Sign up, have a call. We’ll see if it’s right for you. If you’re right for us, we’ll do this. TTP, baby. Yep.
Cody Hofhine: Love it. Guys, do that today, wholesalinginc.com/ttp. I’m telling you, it would be valuable to get on the phone with his team and see if it’s a fit, and if it is, get ready to talk to a ton of people and get me really, really lucky. Thanks, Brett. So glad we could do this together.
Brent Daniels: All right, brother.
Cody Hofhine: All right, take care guys.